Let's talk about stuff that should be avoided

[Unstoppable]

Think about a moment in Invisible War that was so horrible/disappointing. When you find out what it is go on to the next line.

For me it was meeting Tracer Tong in the bar. First off the level was so small. Then meeting him there was no epic quest to it. He was just there and looked like . No secret laboratory or codes to go through. No cool gadget stuff. Nothing at all.

Most definitely this must be avoided. If the main character is going to find something it should be very cool like it was in Deus Ex one. Maggie Chow, Tracer Tong, the doctor dude Jamie Reyes, all had cool ways of finding them in their professions.

So yea note to devs don't screw up meeting super secret characters, whats on your list?

[Nanite]

Originally Posted by Unstoppable

Think about a moment in Invisible War that was so horrible/disappointing. When you find out what it is go on to the next line.

For me it was meeting Tracer Tong in the bar. First off the level was so small. Then meeting him there was no epic quest to it. He was just there and looked like . No secret laboratory or codes to go through. No cool gadget stuff. Nothing at all.

Most definitely this must be avoided. If the main character is going to find something it should be very cool like it was in Deus Ex one. Maggie Chow, Tracer Tong, the doctor dude Jamie Reyes, all had cool ways of finding them in their professions.

So yea note to devs don't screw up meeting super secret characters, whats on your list?

Makes sense there was no codes or cool gadget stuff. Remember now, Alex Jacobson said that Tracer Tong said something about "all the machines in his lab being useless". He probably looked like because he barely survived the Gray Death in DX1. His self esteem went to hell when you finally meet up with him in Vandenburg. For all the pain and trouble he's been through, I'd also be hiding in a bar drinking my problems away.

[Jerion]

Well, while Tong might make some sense, I agree that if you're going to have an awesome character, you should really have a cool build-up, like Tong, Everett, even Jamie.

[Blade_hunter]

The oversimplified gameplay

I mean a game with a low amount of choices and interactions even with the character building and such.
The game should be accessible, but rich and deep as well, removing the gameplay richness and depth would probably disappoint some fans or persons who research a rich and deep game by the game Deus Ex ...

[Jerion]

Originally Posted by pha

Basically, everything that treats the player as an idiot must be avoided.

You mean hand-holding walkthroughs that treat you like you've never played a shooter before? XD

[Irate Iguana]

Originally Posted by Mr. K

You mean hand-holding walkthroughs that treat you like you've never played a shooter before? XD

Those aren't even that bad as long as they are completely optional. I don't want to be forced to sit through those things every time I start a new game.

[gamer0004]

If TT was at least drinking at the bar it wouldn't have been much of a problem, it would've looked like he was just passing through. But he had his own room, and it didn't feel like Tong at all, especially because he didn't wait for you near the entrance. It felt like you accidentally met him, in the place that had become his home, rather then he waited there for you.

[lumpi]

Let's talk about stuff that should be avoided

It's all we're talking about here, anyways...

[hem dazon 90]

hmm how about;

- Make the training level optional

- make sure the cover system is fluid and natral and not the gears of war (no disrespect I love those games) "press x to Velcro your spine to the wall"

- nice big open maps

- finaly well done stealth

[OuttaZyme]

Certainly the many aspects to be avoided aren't limited to those found in IW:

1. Checkpoint-only saves. These must disappear, and soon.

2. Cutscene enemy intros; meaning those Doom 3/Dead Space moments in which the developer fell so much in love with a particular enemy that he wanted you to watch it burst through the wall while wresting control away from you in a manner not quite as annoying as being slapped in the nose with a cod.

3. Squadmates: When the words "get your stupid shot-blocking the holy out of my line of fire, you " might be uttered at regular intervals and irregular decibels. Or, any game released by Ubisoft in the last five years.

4. The color brown. Anyone who's played Resistance 2, back me up on this.

5. "Humorous" enemy chatter in the midst of a fight. Anyone who's played...well, any Halo game, back me up on this. Stupid grunts.

6. Single-player levels that play like nothing more than reheated versions of the game's multiplayer maps. See above.

7. A single-player front-end UI that strives its mightiest to recreate the multiplayer UI so that the typical XBL mouth-breather can successfully navigate to the single-player campaign if -- and only if -- the DSL connection at his parents' house goes down. And don't ever, EVER, call the single-player front-end UI the "Lobby." See #5; once more, with rancor.

8. Focus groups.

[SemiAnonymous]

Originally Posted by OuttaZyme

5. "Humorous" enemy chatter in the midst of a fight. Anyone who's played...well, any Halo game, back me up on this. Stupid grunts.

This.

I hate it. I don't mind chatter, y'know, if someone is shot in the head next to a guy, he goes oh S*** or something, but hearing the stupid AIIIIEEEEEE and WORT WORT WORTs in Halo was just...urgh. Stupid.

[Jerion]

It was funny, but stupid. Much like a number of Comedy Central movies.

Originally Posted by OuttaZyme

Certainly the many aspects to be avoided aren't limited to those found in IW:

1. Checkpoint-only saves. These must disappear, and soon.

2. Cutscene enemy intros; meaning those Doom 3/Dead Space moments in which the developer fell so much in love with a particular enemy that he wanted you to watch it burst through the wall while wresting control away from you in a manner not quite as annoying as being slapped in the nose with a cod.

3. Squadmates: When the words "get your stupid shot-blocking the holy out of my line of fire, you " might be uttered at regular intervals and irregular decibels. Or, any game released by Ubisoft in the last five years.

4. The color brown. Anyone who's played Resistance 2, back me up on this.

5. "Humorous" enemy chatter in the midst of a fight. Anyone who's played...well, any Halo game, back me up on this. Stupid grunts.

6. Single-player levels that play like nothing more than reheated versions of the game's multiplayer maps. See above.

7. A single-player front-end UI that strives its mightiest to recreate the multiplayer UI so that the typical XBL mouth-breather can successfully navigate to the single-player campaign if -- and only if -- the DSL connection at his parents' house goes down. And don't ever, EVER, call the single-player front-end UI the "Lobby." See #5; once more, with rancor.

8. Focus groups.

1. The Checkpoint-Only Save should die. It should be disemboweled and it's soul sent to the Dark Region.

2. Could do with fewer of these. It's acceptable when you have cutscenes for the beginning of a story-important confrontation (a la Walton Simons DX1), but doing cutscene intros just for an enemy fight is annoying. It's like being forced to watch the same cutscene every single time you reload from a checkpoint save. Speaking of checkpoint saves, see no.1.

3. Yep.

4. Ditto. Brown'n'Bloom is a trend that needs to disappear. Thankfully it's not looking like this will be something to worry about in this game.

5. Uh huh. Depends on the mood of the fight though, sometimes this is ok. Other times it just sounds like plucky comic relief for the sake of plucky comic relief.

6. Anybody remember the days when multiplayer maps played like reheated and reorganized versions of the game's single player maps? Yeah, those were good times.

7. Yeah. SP UI doesn't need to be similar to the MP UI. This is a stupid mistake; the HUD should be tailored to the particular game's experience, and if that means that the SP and MP are different experiences then give them different HUDs! Again, seeing as how DX3 is (at least at the time of initial release) going to be single player only, I don't think this is something to worry about here. It's a trend that should be bucked though.

8. Well, yes.

[Irate Iguana]

Totally agree with every point you made. Those are a few of the more common annoyances with "modern" gaming. To this list I'd like to add:

- 1 word replies: If I'm going to be given a dialog choice that might have consequences for my gameplay I'd like to know in advance what that line entails. Seeing "hostages" and thinking that I'll be saving the hostages only to hear the PC speaking about exterminating both the terrorists and hostages ticks me off. Give me the whole line, or nothing.

- Quick Time Events: Having to do a fast game of "Simon Says" during a cutscene or in the game before my character does something is annoying. Especially if he fails the level because of it and I need to redo the QTE.

- Minigames: Please keep these out of the game. Most are highly annoying after the first time. Especially if the same game is used for everything. The vast majority of them add nothing to enhance the gameplay. All they do is force you to sit through something you don't want in order to play the game you actually want to play. Making them optional by including a bypass option isn't good enough. If you have to have a minigame make it like pazaak in the KotOR series.

Originally Posted by OuttaZyme

5. "Humorous" enemy chatter in the midst of a fight. Anyone who's played...well, any Halo game, back me up on this. Stupid grunts.

The grunts were annoying. However there was humorous enemy chatter in Fallout 1 and 2 and that didn't get annoying. There were plenty of interesting NPC combat barks. Some quite hilarious.

[Blade_hunter]

I want to add some to this list

- An intrusive and big HUD really the console style HUDs are just ugly and intrusive

- View auto switch of my character when I do a specific action ( keep the main view as much as possible whatever the selected view )

- Too much cutscenes and unskippable cutscenes (I want to play a game not watch a movie when I want to play a game)

- Tiny levels (I want exploration !!)

- Rail style levels (Deus Ex is a dungeon crawler remember ?)

- Weapons with no recoil, underpowered weapons, no expandable crosshairs, a single weapon is only able to make instant kills, no reloading ...

[Red]

Please avoid using chest-high walls and health regeneration in the game.


Oh wait-

[Irate Iguana]

Originally Posted by Blade_hunter

- Too much cutscenes and unskippable cutscenes (I want to play a game not watch a movie when I want to play a game)

Unskippable cut scenes are just plain evil. There is nothing more annoying than being forced to watch a specific cut scene when you have already watched it 10 times. Bonus points if the cut scene plays just after a save so you'll have to watch it again if you die.

Another thing I hate is if you have a cut scene before you are being thrown in a fight. You have to watch the cut scene. After that you have a few moments before control over your character is being given back to you. During this time you can't do anything, but the enemies get to react so you are forced to soak up a lot of damage before you are allowed to fight. I hate that.

[Jerion]

Originally Posted by Red

Please avoid using chest-high walls and health regeneration in the game.


Oh wait-

Hey now, what's up with the hating on chest-high walls? Do they just irritate you so, taunting you with the ability to see over them but not being able to go through them? =P

[Red]

Originally Posted by Mr. K

Hey now, what's up with the hating on chest-high walls? Do they just irritate you so, taunting you with the ability to see over them but not being able to go through them? =P

Because they exist for only (and only) one purpose - to force players into the damń (3rd person) cover system.

[Viktoria]

Originally Posted by ZylonBane

You just don't know when to stop, do you?

Its okay. I deleted the video link.

[El_Bel]

Uhm.... why?

[-=fox=-]

Wrong hole.

[El_Bel]

Well i want very much to say something about a members wrong hole right now, but i will not say anything because i bet i am going to be baned.

[Viktoria]

I think you mean heroine...

[SemiAnonymous]

Originally Posted by Irate Iguana

Unskippable cut scenes are just plain evil. There is nothing more annoying than being forced to watch a specific cut scene when you have already watched it 10 times. Bonus points if the cut scene plays just after a save so you'll have to watch it again if you die.

Another thing I hate is if you have a cut scene before you are being thrown in a fight. You have to watch the cut scene. After that you have a few moments before control over your character is being given back to you. During this time you can't do anything, but the enemies get to react so you are forced to soak up a lot of damage before you are allowed to fight. I hate that.

I don't mind it (as much) if its unskippable the first time. Too many times I've missed cutscenes that were skippable simply because I accidentally hit a button. But if you die and have to review it, I see no reason to make it unskippable. I mean, whats the point? Its not like the cutscene is some sort of cinematic masterpiece that will only improve the experience each and every time you see it, it's just annoying.

This goes for replays too. My top complaint about Ocarina of Time is none of the cutscenes are skippable. Ever. theres an hour of cutscenes you can't skip over, its annoying as hell and a time waste. Unskippable the first time and the first time only, after that, hit a button and skip, even in replays.

[Blade_hunter]

Skippable cinematics are the best, if you want to watch them or not that's your choice, I don't want even to be forced to watch them even at the first time they pass, in deus ex this was good and really, I hate unskippable cinematics.

And if you want to solve your problem, you can suggest a menu to replay cinematics you have "unlocked" in your walkthrough if you want to watch them again, there is a couple of games who have that option.

I think red isn't alone to hate chest-high walls I am in that case too