How many levels should there be?

[Pyronox]

Infinity.

[DarthEnder]

However many Thief 2 Gold was supposed to have.

[13LACK13ISHOP]

As many as possible. Bring on the maps I say

[citywolfdreams]

Originally Posted by Hypevosa

The city venture was half the level for life of the party... it would be like having TDS sized missions tacked onto a city hub again, without the reliability of the city hub. I'd rather have a well designed, plenty of flare and flavor city hub... if it says I'm in a mission I'd rather be IN the mission, i.e. where I'm supposed to be. If they make a city hub WELL, then I'd like to have it alot, but if they just make small loading sectors like in TDS, I'd rather not have it. To me, the city hub should just be the size of 2 levels combined in one... Have the thieve's highway, and make it really easy to get from one place to the other via the rooftops for those who want to just get mission to mission, and then let the people who ENJOY the city hub (like me) to travel the streets, pickpocketing random folk, and overhearing conversations and whatnot. Obviously there would need to be roof access for the fences and stores, but still, it could be done, and rather well.

Yeah, it COULD be done, and done well... but it would much more likely be screwed up beyond all recognition. The fact that you're using Life of the Party as the example just supports my case. The reason they were able to build a level that flavorful and awesome is because they didn't have to worry about building an entire city: they just focused on areas that you might see. For example, when you were 500 feet up in the air and couldn't get to street level without falling (and thus dying), they didn't need to put too much detail into the streets below - just graphics and a few wandering NPCs down below to give you the illusion of vastness. Can you imagine how hard it would be to create something that much fun if they had to worry about all the stuff IN those buildings as well? There's only so much game world that developers can build while still making it fun. Otherwise it just becomes like Oblivion, where you have a huge game world, but the inside of almost every house is one room (simply because the designers never had time to flesh out more).

What you're envisioning would be cool if it were done right, but it would take an impossible amount of resources to do well. Honestly, if anyone can pull off something like this, it would most likely be the fans, since only Thief modders have the dedication to put that amount of painstaking detail into what they do.

[Hypevosa]

Why does everyone think it's impossible to expect a quality product?

[jtr7]

I don't, but we have nothing to go by but promises. Real vs. ideal. No amount of positive thinking by us is going to magically make a better game, make the devs more skilled, make the software more powerful and easy to work with, increase the artists' skills, etc. We can only wish and hope, but real life always has its way, and it's a gamble.

I haven't seen what we are hoping for in a new Thief game ever done, so the odds are against it. Not "impossible" at all, and nearly every one of us is giving them a chance, giving them our hopes and well-wishes, and excited to see what they will have to show us.

[DarthEnder]

Originally Posted by Hypevosa

Why does everyone think it's impossible to expect a quality product?

Experience?

[AbysmalGale]

I'd say 15-20 missions would be great. Absolutely not less than 15, and not more than 20. And I want them HUGE (most of them).

[EMCEE]

Originally Posted by darthender

however many thief 2 gold was supposed to have.

+1!)

[esme]

as many as are needed to tell the story with maybe a few, perhaps optional, extra levels

[Yaphy]

14-16 missions. And some side missions. About 10 of them.

[DoomyDoomyDoomDoom]

How many levels should there be?

....100?

At the least, enough to keep me from beating the game in one day. Also, I'd like little 'side missions'. Throw a bunch of those in. They would be relatively small missions with like a small manor or something. I'd like that. And they could have their own little stories, maybe even connected to each other or something.

[Sierra Oscar]

15 or 16 missions would make me happy. Large levels at that.

[lefty]

The number of levels should depend on the size of the levels. As for a city hub... The missions should be divided as they were in the first two, and if a mission requires there to be a section of the city in it, then it would have that.

[citywolfdreams]

Originally Posted by Hypevosa

Why does everyone think it's impossible to expect a quality product?

Well, speaking as a former programmer, it's because of something called "the development cycle." Unlike fan-made missions, commercial programmers can't work on a level until "it FEELS right" - they are given a certain time limit to accomplish Task X, and if it isn't done by that point they sort have to half-ass it as best as they can.

Looking Glass Studios was the exception to the rule - that company was more focused on quality rather than speed, and that is why they churned out such great games like Thief and System Shock - because they would spend as much time as it took to make the game great. That was also the flaw in their business model - because they fell behind, they grew increasingly reliant on their next game to be a success - essentially borrowing from their future expectations - and from a business perspective, it was only inevitable that they would fail.

[ToMegaTherion]

15 huge levels and an enormous well-developed city would probably be a little too much for what is essentially a very simple game with few elements.

[jtr7]

15 missions in a huge city, with only a small portion that is mission-centric.

I'd still prefer richer T1/T2-sized missions with extra explorability and city life within the same dimensions, and most of the missions in separate areas of The City and beyond, with a couple back-to-back.