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#1
06-04-2009, 10:41 AM
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To Robin, or Not to Robin?
It's been explained several times why multiplayer is not available in this game. I personally am looking forward to Sefton Hill and Rocksteady producing the best Batman game possible, as it is long overdue. So, if they say that they need to focus intimately on capturing the most crucial aspects of Batman and his villains as far as story, design, and gameplay, then I don't want them tacking on a half-done multiplayer option as a desperate after-thought. That being said, I want to know who agrees that in a sequel it'd be great to have an optional splitscreen co-op experience in the main campain that builds upon the current gameplay in this title?
I for one am a huge Robin/Nightwing fan and think they not only enrich the character history/storytelling of Batman, but also present a rare well-designed co-op opportunity in this modern day gaming world. It would be more than the beat-em up Ubi-Soft's Rise Of Sin-Tsu was, but instead incorporate and build upon the same core gameplay elements (Free-Flow Combat, Silent Predator, Detective mode, Free roaming exploration) currently in Batman Arkham Asylum. Besides enjoying the well-developed characters, I just think we live in a single-player gaming world that is designed for the "only-child" who apparently has no friends in close vicinity (unless you're into shooters or v.s. multiplayer), thus all of the online multiplayer and competitive gaming options. This type of game would be nice to play side-by-side with a buddy, because it seems to be intelligently crafted and immersive. Most co-op action games that do exist seem to have watered-down storytelling and restrictive gameplay. And while I'm aware that Robin hasn't had the best go-around at being adapted from his useful role in the comics into other mediums (save the animated series versions, Teen Titans, and yeah even "The Batman" though admittedly that show was camptastic with terrible character design/development - they did a decent Robin), I just think that it's something that should be not only explored, but realized. I think that if Rocksteady and Paul Dini come back for more, it's definitely somewhere they shoul start. Some sort of "pop-in and pop-out" co-op feature, perhaps even with opportunities to split-up. After playing Resident Evil 5, no one wants to have to babysit a clumsy A.I. support character, so having the feature be some sort of optional drop-in/exit anytime mechanic would be nice for when a friend stops by. Perhaps, Batman can give some sort of command or Robin can signal and they can animate the now inactive partner character making a narrow escape, suggesting they are leaving to further investigate on their own. The ability to play as Tim Drake Robin, Nightwing, or even the Cassandra Cain Batgirl in the single player campain would make for a nice unlockable as well. Anyway, thanks for humoring me. I know I've rambled a lot here about a potential sequel to a game that isn't even out yet. First and foremost I look forward to enjoying Batman Arkham Asylum. I hope it's everybit the videogame Batman reinvention we're all clamoring for. I look forward to a demo on Playstation network and Xbox Live. 
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#2
06-04-2009, 12:52 PM
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Story and theme of the game is the relationship between Batman and the Joker.
Robins, Nightwing and the Bat girls should be in a Gotham Knight setting.
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#3
06-04-2009, 01:13 PM
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Why does this game need a sequel? Why? Some games are great and can be left alone. If they do a sequel it has to be co-op with Robin as an A.I. for the people with no firends (no offense). Online co-op could be fun. But if you think about it, this game has a lot of possibilities for the future. But if they do a sequel, Robin will be in it most likely.
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Mercenaries 2: World in Flames Thread
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#5
06-04-2009, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
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#6
06-04-2009, 02:55 PM
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Been a long time Batman fan and I have never really been a fan of Robin/Nightwing. They had their times when the story was great but overall they became an annoyance.
__________________
"And when you're sitting here alone in the middle of the night, unsleeping in the dark, remember -- every breath you take you owe to me."
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#7
06-04-2009, 02:58 PM
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 Grayson, then there is no Tim Drake. Everyone who talks about Batman 3 or even this game dont want any Robin anyways,whether its Jason,, or Tim.
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#8
06-04-2009, 03:00 PM
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I could honestly do without additional members of the Bat-Family aside from having Oracle for remote-assistance and perhaps using Alfred as a field medic to help him out. While each is a unique individual they were all trained by Bruce and despite their differing personalities their combat styles would be extremely similar. There are so many other facets of Batman that could be explored without ever touching on Robin, Nightwing, or Batgirl. I'd rather they continue on that road, rather than just tacking on Sidekicks for co-op gameplay.
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#9
06-04-2009, 03:01 PM
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Again Abeja you're bringing false statements. You have no statistic or any proof that everyone hates the Robins. So stop trying to sound like a troll. ;]
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#11
06-04-2009, 03:09 PM
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Quote:
__________________
"And when you're sitting here alone in the middle of the night, unsleeping in the dark, remember -- every breath you take you owe to me."
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#13
06-04-2009, 03:13 PM
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Even i am againts Robin in Nolan serie. I mean it can work in a hyperrealistic world but i don't think Nolan wants to show Batman training a little near-teenager into crime fightning, while it would show more of his insane side to actually beliefing himself into training a youngster and whatnot. Its best to leave that alone.
But really i wouldn't mind a No Man's Land or anything Gotham City related and having playable Cassandra Cain Batgirl, Nightwing, Tim Drake Robin and so forth.
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#14
06-04-2009, 03:14 PM
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They are heavily against Robin for a reason. Batman is cool because he is a lone fighter, he isn't nearly as cool when he has multiple people helping him out. Not to mention these days having 12 year olds fighting crime with you is kinda creepy.
Also, multiplayer in my opinion is a bad idea. The point of Batman is there is only one unique person that has his skill, having multiple people with his exact skills running around would not only be not fun but extremely boring.
__________________
"And when you're sitting here alone in the middle of the night, unsleeping in the dark, remember -- every breath you take you owe to me."
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#15
06-04-2009, 03:16 PM
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Even in Nolan serie Batman is never alone, he has Gordon, Alfred, Luscious at his side. Sadly he lost Harvey and Rachel and will forever blame himself for their deaths, as thats what Batman does. Blames himself for absolutely everything.
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#16
06-04-2009, 03:19 PM
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No Man's Land would be a great sequel for this game, but I would still want it to be a single player campaign focusing on Batman. If you wanted to have the others show up during missions occasionally or provide exposition for the story I'm alright with that too. Adding them as playable characters though just doesn't appeal to me at all in the campaign. I /could/ however, see a set of challenges like the Silent Knight challenge or the Special Ops mode reportedly in Modern Warfare 2 that could be done cooperatively.
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#18
06-04-2009, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
__________________
"And when you're sitting here alone in the middle of the night, unsleeping in the dark, remember -- every breath you take you owe to me."
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#19
06-04-2009, 03:30 PM
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 That was my point, while i kinda did derive it from the "lone non sidekick crime fighter" into "lone batman is not lonely at all" kinda thing. ^^
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#20
06-04-2009, 05:29 PM
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I say yay for Robin to appear in the sequel, if they decide to make one. I know this game is about building a competent gaming engine for Batman and redeeming his videogame reputation, but the next game should build on that, and one of the ways to do it is by co-op. While the offline game should be single player (I agree with the RE AI comment) there should be an option for a co-op story mode (online or system link)
And it seems to me the majority of Robin bashers just jumped aboard the Batman bandwagon because of the Nolan movies, and neglect the 50+ year history he has with Batman. They say Batman is a loner, but he's a loner not by nature, but by choice as he can't handle the guilt of the death of close friends. But Robin DOES belong in almost every iteration of Batman, whether it's the movies or this game here. If anything contrary could be proven, he would have died off in the comics long ago.
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#21
06-04-2009, 05:51 PM
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A lot of heroes exist in the DC Universe thanks to Batman's mentorship. His first protege,
Grayson, took over for him in the comics while he is away, slipping into parallel realities or whatever Darkside's beams did to him. So it is a good thing Batman is smart enough to train people in their youths and have them carry on the mantle when he can't. The supporting cast keeps Batman sane and connected to the world.
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#22
06-04-2009, 08:12 PM
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I guess I'm not surprised by the mixed response. I have no real problem with people's personal opinion of what characters are cool and what characters aren't. Everyone has their own reasons. The trickiest thing about adapting long running comic book characters, particularly Batman and Superman, is that everyone has a differing favorite version. Everyone has their own idea of what the character needs to be. But just for perspective's sake, I'd like to point out that Batman debued in Detective Comics, in 1939. 11 months, not even a full year afterwards, Richard Grayson / Robin was introduced in 1940. In much of the 1940's Detective Comics' Batman stories were still moody and atmospheric detective cases. Unfortunately, the 50's ushered in a new era of camp for all comic book superheroes, as the stories looked to keep the characters fresh and interesting with over-the-top Sci-Fi gimmicks and melodrama that were not character driven (my opinion of course).
Comic books have almost died out several times thereafter (which is why Waner Bros. owns D.C.) however, the concept of Robin has continued to thrive. Robin is a key theme in the Bat-mythos. Grayson is so beloved even as a former Robin that fans wouldn't stand for him being killed-off in the recent "Crisis". Jason Todd was killed off by the fans in the 80's, where as Grayson was spared more than 20 years after that. Tim Drake was embraced enough to be the first "sidekick" to have his own solo title. Grayson as a character has taken on a life of his own, especially considering they had to rewrite the ending of a D.C. mega-crossover event just to keep him alive with new stories to tell. Grayson and Drake both have endured for a reason; Thematically, they work well for the Bat-mythos. The enduring characters and concepts in Batman thrive for a reason and that reason is, because everything that befits Batman's world reflects some aspect of the character himself on some deeper level - whether it's a villain, ally, or even Gotham itself. Anyway, Batman's not half the loner he thinks he is. Bruce, despite what he likes to believe is still very much human and misery loves company. He never pulls anyone into his life, but Gotham tragically pulls kindred spirits towards him. I'll be the first to admit that the "Bat-Family" is currently overrun (Knight & Squire anybody?), but I'd say Alfred, Robin, Nightwing, Batgirl, and Oracle are keepers. Robin particularly represents the idealistic boy in Bruce that got buried alongside his parents. Robin is often able to rekindle that hope and be a light to Batman's consuming darkness. Also, Robin represents excellence through hard work and serves as a "Alfred in the field" or otherwise an aid/sounding board while working through cases. Not a crutch, but a welcomed second pair of eyes and fists. Does Robin necessarily belong everywhere and in every storyline? No. No more than Alfred, Lucious, Jim Gordon, or any of the other revolving characters belong in every outing. It's good to see Batman by his lonesome periodically, but you can't deny the success of Robin or the fact that his presence tends to increase fan interest and comics sales. He doesn't belong in the Nolan films simply, because Nolan doesn't like the concept and if his hand gets forced we'll probably see something similar to Venom's appearence in Spidey 3 [ just speculation]. I for one don't want that. Robin deserves better and to be honest Nolan is doing just fine without the character. Last edited by nightdevil1; 06-04-2009 at 08:19 PM.
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#23
06-04-2009, 08:47 PM
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Back to the gaming question: here in Arkham Asylum Robin is also "unnecessary", not in a "he would have ruined the game way" just more of a "nah, don't need him this time, maybe next" sort of deal. In a sequel, incorporating more of Gotham City and more of Bruce's allies I think would be interesting, though there's nothing wrong with the secluded approach of this current title. I actually like the idea a lot. I wonder if there's a way to mix and match?
Since it is cool to have a lone Batman from time to time, that's exactly why I propose the two-player co-op be optional and at-will. If you want to play the whole game as just Batman, you should be able to, however if you want to invite a friend over and play some split-screen with Robin, why not? Also having the option to play through as Robin after beating the game would be a nifty bonus. Adding Robin into the mix should also cause the game to adapt and become increasingly difficult just to keep things interesting. Even though I like kid-Robin, this game would completely side-step that issue, because if Barbara is already Oracle, that means it makes the most since to use Tim who is already 16 years old in the comics now. He also has that cool Red, Black, and gold costume that would fit Rocksteady's/Wildstorm's stylistic choices very well. He doesn't fight exactly like Batman either. Robin is obviously smaller, younger, doesn't hit quite as hard, and definitely unable to intimidate anyone once he confronts his enemies directly. He is typically quicker and more agile than Batman himself (at least by a little bit). He uses his youth as and asset. As Batman uses his intimidating prowess to unerve the enemy, Robin (much like Marvel's Spider-man, though the concept of Robin came first) achieves a similar effect by wisecracking and outmanuvering them until they are so frustrated by the fact that they can't beat this child that they attack wildly and sloppily. That's when Robin hits them hard and fast in their soft spots. Not to say that the character can't hold his own in an all out brawl with his Jackie Chan like reflexes and improvisational techniques.
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#24
06-05-2009, 02:09 AM
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For this game, they should add Nightwing. Oracle in the game means Nightwing should exist. Then add Tim as Robin. But i agree, Nightwing/Robin arent necessary for this game, it would just be cool. Seeing Nightwing on another gargoyle and me as Batman, and we both just survey the thugs,planning.
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#25
06-05-2009, 07:34 AM
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No Robins, thank you! They belong in the comics, and even there, I some times wish they weren't...
If we look back, then the (arguably)best Batman stories are Robin free. I think that Batman vs villian relationship stories are the best ones.
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