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  #1  
Old 05-19-2009, 01:42 PM
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Default SAVE SYSTEM - saving / checkpoints etc

Moderator Update / June 2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by drunken taffer View Post
@domcom360 in Thief there will be both options. A manual save game feature and automatic checkpoint savings.
Just posted by Stephane D'astous





___


Save anywhere.

This game better have it or I WILL cut someone.

I only mention it because I notice that most stealth games these days are all checkpoint based.

Last edited by Viktoria; 06-15-2013 at 02:29 PM. Reason: added update since E3, June 2013
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  #2  
Old 05-19-2009, 01:45 PM
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A checkpoint based save system would be the end of Thief. I wouldn't even play Thief 4 if it had that. Same way I'm not going to play Chronicles of Rid.ick: Assault on Dark Athena (among other things).
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  #3  
Old 05-19-2009, 01:47 PM
simlan simlan is offline
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shouldn't even need to be a question, yes it is wanted
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  #4  
Old 05-19-2009, 01:57 PM
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Ugh checkpoints. What a burning sensation I get when a pc game has save points instead of save anywhere. Yeh, I'd be pissed too if Thief 4 didn't let me save anytime I want.

Does anybody else like to play no save style? Not just in Thief. Sometimes I like to challenge myself by only allowing myself to save between missions or major segments in other games....Or if I have to leave the game for a long while. Sometimes it feels like cheating to save before making an unsure move. That is a players choice though and it should always be.
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  #5  
Old 05-19-2009, 02:04 PM
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It was in the previous three games, I don't see a problem with it being in Thief 4. Nobody needs to be cut.
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  #6  
Old 05-19-2009, 02:05 PM
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I'm a 'checkpoint-hater'. Not much more to add to what has already been said...
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  #7  
Old 05-19-2009, 05:01 PM
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One of the best parts of games is the ability to do what you want without repercussions, and a save anywhere system lets you do that. Thief especially, when something is unusually risky, like trying to blackjack 2 guards in 2 seconds (like the first 2 guards you meet in metal age... lean left *club lean right *club* ...)

In fallout 3, if something has just frustrated me to oblivion (haha) I will pull out my alien blaster and lay waste to the entirety of megaton in seconds... and maybe do it a second time, just for the therapeutic value. Same think happened in thief, I'd save right before a guard killed me and then proceed to shoot him repeatedly (ending my game since I only play on expert) but still making me satisfied.

Checkpoints imply linear levels, IF THERE ARE ANY LINEAR LEVELS OTHER THAN CHASE SCENES IN THIEF (although point A to point B should still be more like a thousand paths than one), the developers have committed a sin against the series, and will earn every ounce of hate mail they will receive. The exploration and the non-linearity must remain at the heart of level design, and thus make checkpoints a stupid thing to include.
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  #8  
Old 05-19-2009, 05:03 PM
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Yes. However, also introduce an autosave after each level.
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  #9  
Old 05-19-2009, 05:49 PM
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Checkpoints make sense only with highly-linear gameplay.

We don't want that.

Therefore we shouldn't be using checkpoints.

Imagine trying to play the First City Bank & Trust level in Thief 2 with a "checkpoint" system. Doesnt' mesh. If it ever looks sensible to implement a similar system, it should be a signal that something is very very wrong.
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  #10  
Old 05-19-2009, 05:58 PM
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Mid level checkpoints don't lend themselves well the Thief's style of gameplay. BEcause of the non-linear fashion the levels move in, it is impractical. Checkpoints aren't a terrible idea for some games, especially games that involve a lot of trial and error like the first two Splinter Cell games. But for non-linear games like Thief, they just don't work well.

I wouldn't mind an auto-save after you finish a level, however. I've had an entire day's progress destroyed because the power went out before, and I was too engaged in the game to remember to quick save.
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  #11  
Old 05-19-2009, 06:00 PM
LightWarriorK LightWarriorK is offline
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There are some games where I really enjoy checkpoints and save points, like in JRPG games like Final Fantasy, or NO save feature at all, like in platformers like the old Sonic games or Contra.

In those cases, limiting or eliminating saves not only highten the tention and drama of a game, but force the player to evolve into a better player.

The Thief games, other stealth, and open-ended RPGs like Fallout3, don't play the same way. They play more like survival games, and being able to save and load anywhere is pretty crucial to being able to enjoy them.

When I first started playing Thief, I abhorred the quick-save feature. It was the first game I had played that had it. But after finding out how many tries it took to get by some of the guards, and just how LONG the levels were, I did come to love it.

I'm all FOR keeping this in Thief 4.
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  #12  
Old 05-20-2009, 09:52 AM
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Yeah, while I like to play 'no loads allowed' during missions. I DON'T need to force everyone else to play like me. So, I think Thi4f should allow saves anywhere.

That said, here is an INTERESTING game concept in regards to saves. There was a game called Severance: Blade of Darkness. You could save your progress anytime during that game. However, the more saves you used during the game, the lower your 'bravery' score would be reduced.

I would like to see something like that = would encourage players to at least try to become better thieves.

* The 'bravery' score didn't effect the game in any way...it just let the player know how 'brave/skilled' they were.
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  #13  
Old 05-20-2009, 11:18 AM
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check points are EVIL!
sad memories I have from having to repeat the whole thing and cutscenes over and over in FF7 (or any other) just because I died when the boss had 1hp left...

aaaaaarrrrgggghhh.... one can comit suicide from that

Checkpoints are good for games where you don't necessarilly fail or die or ruin everything from making a big mistake (i.e. Fahrenheit). They also aren't much painstaking in COD series. Other than that, they could even not exist.
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  #14  
Old 05-20-2009, 11:30 AM
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Why change to the checkpoint system? Thief has always allowed saving at any moment.
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  #15  
Old 05-21-2009, 10:31 PM
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Please don't use HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE registry entry pointing to User's "My Documents" folder. That's just stupid. HKEY_CURRENT_USER or %Username% in the path or a folder with all-user access. Saves should be easily moved from one instance of the game to another. And user options too.
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  #16  
Old 05-29-2009, 02:18 PM
KSingh77 KSingh77 is offline
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Checkpoints is going to be a big poo if it was added in the game so no thanks.
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  #17  
Old 05-29-2009, 03:40 PM
Sierra Oscar Sierra Oscar is offline
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I despise checkpoints, so I am all for the good ol manual save and auto save at the start of the level.
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  #18  
Old 05-29-2009, 04:19 PM
Slickleg Slickleg is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoomyDoomyDoomDoom View Post
Does anybody else like to play no save style?
I love playing Thief this way. It makes everything you do waaay more tense. I definitely recommend it for anyone who's a bit bored with the game but wants to revisit it.
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  #19  
Old 05-30-2009, 12:15 AM
ToMegaTherion ToMegaTherion is offline
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The only advantage of some form of save limiting system is in order to dissuade people from reloading if, for example, they set off an alarm and alert lots of guards. It probably isn't worth annoying us for this advantage.
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  #20  
Old 05-30-2009, 01:34 AM
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I just save when i quit playing for the time. Its no fun saving all the time. It doesnt matter if you do something wrong when saving whenever it is gettin hard. We are playing at harder diffculty because whe want challenge. How much fun is it if you just save all the time. No checkpoints though! I need to save when i want to quit playing!

No checkpoint system. Save whenever you want to, i guess its a moral choice if you want to destroy the gameplay by saving at every hard location.
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  #21  
Old 05-30-2009, 02:11 PM
DarknessFalls DarknessFalls is offline
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I love my ALT+S quicksave, ALT+L quickload. Checkpoints would not be appreciated in the Thief series.
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  #22  
Old 05-30-2009, 03:48 PM
Sierra Oscar Sierra Oscar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToMegaTherion View Post
The only advantage of some form of save limiting system is in order to dissuade people from reloading if, for example, they set off an alarm and alert lots of guards. It probably isn't worth annoying us for this advantage.
Well, thats the players choice really though.
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  #23  
Old 05-30-2009, 11:59 PM
ToMegaTherion ToMegaTherion is offline
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That's true, but since there isn't much point in making a level with an elaborate alarm system when most people are going to reload every time it's activated, a sensible conclusion for the designers is that alarm systems are to be avoided. I quite like alarm levels, but I don't think I like them enough to have any restricted saving.
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  #24  
Old 05-31-2009, 01:56 AM
Fire_Is_Born Fire_Is_Born is offline
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Why would you ever want checkpoints? No, seriously, all it means is that if you have a hard level, players have to see the first section over and over... So they get bored and leave. I stopped playing Lego Starwars 2, not because I grew up or anything ;-) but because you had to play the whole hour+ level in one go thanks to the ridiculous save system.
So yeah, don't ruin what is set to be an epic game, save anywhere.
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  #25  
Old 06-29-2009, 09:40 PM
Fatherwoodsie Fatherwoodsie is offline
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Default Saving Options

im sorry if this thread has already been started, i apologize. how would you guys like to save your games? how should or shouldnt be set up?

i thought the saving options in deadly shadows were completly confusing and irrelevant. the time stamps were irrelevant. if their going to make you save a game that way, they SHOULD put a little picture frame next to the time stamp of the exact location you were at when you saved in so you know what it looks like instead of having to guess times. no? i did like the saving options in the T1 and T2 but there werent enough, i think. so if theyre going to keep the same saving options, PLEASE put pictures next to them!
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