YOUR THOUGHTS & WISHES & SUGGESTIONS for T4 - General Discussion

[Rieknor]

Originally Posted by Platinumoxicity

Seeing hands on ladders is problematic because of 1 thing... There has to be a dynamic system that releases one hand from the ladder when the player turns around to look behind him on the ladder. Because you know, it hurts your neck pretty bad when you try to turn your head 360°. When in the stance of looking away from the ladder, the player can also jump off the ladder to whichever direction he wants.

And no I don't support at all the ladder climbing system that TDS had. No ability to turn and look back? No ability to get off the ladder to any other directions than on the bottom and the top?
Oh, and don't even get me started on the climbing gloves.

Yes you are right.

After i post that, i think about you just said but i got lazy and dindt edit it.

[Rieknor]

I allways admired people who are able to resist a lot of pain. My idea is to give Garret one part of the game when he is going to suffer a torture and he will resist it and scape from the people who are torturing him.(sorry Garret =P)

This is just an idea, and you may not like it. And thats fine becouse is not really a good idea.(but just in case)



damn it, i forgot the other two.

[jtr7]

After Garrett's torture at the hands of Viktoria, I don't think he's that capable of withstanding much (not including the game-mechanics), unless he has a plan.

[Rieknor]

Originally Posted by jtr7

After Garrett's torture at the hands of Viktoria, I don't think he's that capable of withstanding much (not including the game-mechanics), unless he has a plan.

Torture? She just ripped off his eye. (?)

I didnt think in that as a torture.
But anyway, i dont care much about this.

[jtr7]

Do you think "torture" only means painful interrogation, or something like that? Being slammed backward into a pillar, and bound, having his eye plucked out, etc., isn't terrifying and painful enough?

[esme]

well being pedantic, torture for me at least does imply nasty stuff performed over a long time, I'd call the eye gouging more of an assault causing grievous bodily harm

potayto-potahto it was still pretty nasty

[Yaphy]

Torture doesn't have to take long time. But torture is also used to get something. Information of some sort...or the torturer just wants to have a bit of "fun".

[Rieknor]

Originally Posted by esme

well being pedantic, torture for me at least does imply nasty stuff performed over a long time, I'd call the eye gouging more of an assault causing grievous bodily harm

potayto-potahto it was still pretty nasty

This is what im talking about.

[Rieknor]

Originally Posted by jtr7

Do you think "torture" only means painful interrogation, or something like that? Being slammed backward into a pillar, and bound, having his eye plucked out, etc., isn't terrifying and painful enough?

Not interrogation, in some cases could be, but i dont think it will be Garret case.

But, you know, if he got cought sometime in the history of the game, the person/grup/whatever who caught him want to kill him,and before, they will torture him.

Why?Many reasons: Back then, in that time, when you steal something they put you in jail and they cut your hands.(But of course, in stead of cuttin his hands, some other kind of torture becouse, the eye his hads, he'll end up as robocop)
Another reason: If those people are some kind of sadistic sect they will torturate him before they offer a sacrify to them god(or etc.)


Something like that. Like I said before, is not a realy good idea, but just in case you may like it.



Changeing the subject.

Who miss the singing Hammertites?When they were whistleing and the lalalas in the TDP.

[Hypevosa]

Originally Posted by jtr7

Do you think "torture" only means painful interrogation, or something like that? Being slammed backward into a pillar, and bound, having his eye plucked out, etc., isn't terrifying and painful enough?

When torture comes to mind, it tends to have a duration of being near instantaneous.

"my back is torturing me" "this class is torture" "they tortured the subject until he confessed"

I'd call what happened to Garret truly traumatic, but I wouldn't say it was torture (though I'm sure that the pain leftover from having an eyeball ripped out would be). That's my two cents about it at least.

[Namdrol]

I really don't want you to think I'm following you around disagreeing for the sake of it because I'm not. I actually rather respect your opinion and your presentation of such but I'm afraid the connotation of torture in the examples you gave is the total opposite of near instantaneous.

[Hypevosa]

that was the point. I was giving examples of where people describe something as a torture, and how each of them is not near instantaneous but is something that bugs them, irritates them, hurts them for more than a few moments. I was giving examples of torture, not of instantaneous things.

[Rieknor]

As i think the torture thing isnt so important, just say, yes or no, with out any explanations.


But what do you think about the old hammerites singing in their ships?

[DarknessFalls]

I hope T4 has it so when you are aiming your arrow and you're hiding behind something, that when you shoot, the arrow goes to where you were aiming, rather than into the object right in front of you. Too many games can't pull this off and it drives me bonkers. If I have the enemy in my sights, the projectile should reach that destination. Period Same with mines and flash bombs, and other things you toss. If I'm aiming to the middle of a room and toss something, it should not land at my feet and explode. Wasted ammo and self-inflicted pain simply because of this bug should not cause a QuickLoad.

Yes, I know "why" it happens, but there must be a way to program around it. Some games are good at avoiding this issue, others not so much.

[Namdrol]

Originally Posted by Rieknor

...just say, yes or no, with out any explanations.

What? Us pernickity fools? Wrong forum

[MoroseTroll]

VIKTORIA: What about Cyrillics support in Thief 4? You see, there are many nations using Cyrillics (more than 300 million of people), so it would be nice for them .

[Gocha]

You better do original remake of at least first two games, because many nowdays gamers don't know that series i'm pretty sure and it's in many foreign countries and this also for that games for now have no good graphics. So you probably have to not expect high interest in the forth installment.

Anyway my best regards.

[esme]

Originally Posted by Gocha

You better do original remake of at least first two games, because many nowdays gamers don't know that series i'm pretty sure and it's in many foreign countries and this also for that games for now have no good graphics. So you probably have to not expect high interest in the forth installment.

Anyway my best regards.

oh hell no! those games are out there and people can buy and play them, there's no need or desire for a remake we want Garrett to move on with his story

[Dooley]

Firstly:
Keep the features of the original first and second games.
Those who claim 'we don't need' are one sided tunnel thinkers who need to be slapped and thrown out a high story window.
Cutting establishment means cutting canon. Don't cut canon.

Secondly:
Fix the logo, release a toolset (preferably within a month or two of the games release), avoid feature creep, and support the game after its release.

Please Do Not: Rely on DLC, or cut content from the game to release as DLC.
Marketing Advice: DLC in the form of equipment will probably not sell well, as many of us have no need of 'extra' equipment.
Hell, I found that with the craptastic sandbox level design in 'Deadly Shadows' I needed either a horse cart full of water arrows, or nothing at all.
DLC in the form of extra missions, difficulty settings, etc, will fly. Want me to buy the game? Take a page out of BioWare's book. Release a game, then release the DLC to those who can connect with a legit copy of the game.

[KJELL]

O i have a wishlist alright.
-Making the map out of one piece like maffia or gta, surrounded by sea, we dont care about data size, if we need 7 dvd's thats better then 2
-fluid movement,
-higher jump or jumpcrounch,
-ability to get under tables,
-diferentiating bow angle influenced by obj, under a table above box the bow gets tilted.
-getting arrows back out of the body's, and lots of blood (realistic blood)
-family's, not just ppl living alone in a house. (realism)
-dogs, cats owls horses and crows
-1st person
-Alerted guards should be able to be killed by one arrow in the head unless helmet
-guards patrolling together after to much murders,
-different animations for different ppl, not everyone bends over when they see something moving, more realism.

-a deadly forrest to put a boundry on the map, other side sea with sharp rocks and sharks maybe a swamp in the forrest or a wherewolf, or both, the wherewolf comes when u get stuck AWHOOOO
Be sure to put out sighns, like the builder SAVES
and red seemed to be the color to stain glass for candlepots, and windowtrimmings.
It is all these little things that make u think u are in the middle ages, where are the guilliotines and shame poles?
over where i live there is still a huge stone shame pole where they used to tie ppl up to throw rotten stuff to, ironicaly it is on the next to the church on the town square
http://www.flickr.com/photos/erfgoed/2388313436/
realy interesting pictures

[jtr7]

Thief's not medieval, The City's not on an island so small if at all, not a gore-fest, and your list requires doubling the team size and development cycle and exploding the budget at the very least. Having the bow angle compensate for the near environment is interesting. Seeing you list 1st-person makes me smile. Thanks.

[Platinumoxicity]

Originally Posted by KJELL

-Making the map out of one piece like maffia or gta, surrounded by sea, we dont care about data size, if we need 7 dvd's thats better then 2

I agree about your thoughts on the absence of loading zones, but not on the thought of having an open City. No matter how large chunk of City you make, it's still a tiny portion of the actual size of the City, which is somewhere between the size of New York and the size of the Universe.

[DarknessFalls]

Actually, his list seems pretty modest in terms of complexity. I don't see how that would cause a doubling of the team and time to build. I don't agree with everything s/he says, but they all seem like they'd be pretty simple to accommodate while building the game. In terms of complexity only, here's a quick breakdown (I'm not saying I agree with them all):

- Fluid movement? Mo-cap. Hopefully already planned.
- Higher jump/crouch? Increase Y axis height reached when specific button(s) is pressed.
- Get under tables? Implement crawl (decrease Y, and tweak camera movement).
- Bow angle? I don't really understand what is being said, but from my interpretation, seems like another Y-angle tweak.
- Get arrows back? Retrieve from body instead of probably already planned ground or wall. Figure out clipping issues would be a little more difficult, but wouldn't require a doubling of the team. Or just do what Dark Mod did, and have the death blow arrow retrievable.
- Blood? Increase red stains, spurts and pools. Not sure why this would require more resources.
- Families? Add a few more neutral NCPs walking around house and interacting. Probably already planned.
- Animals? Mo-cap and models. Probably already planned.
- 1st person? Assuming this is already going in.
- Alerted guard headshot kills? Give head zone high damage susceptibility. Hopefully already planned.
- Guards patrol together after murders? Just takes it a step further than T1/T2's AI that alerted each other and searched via word-of-mouth.
- Different animations for ppl? Additional mo-cap time.
- Map boundaries? Not that big of deal to implement, imo. Most games already have stupid artificial boundaries, this is just a smidgen more creative than most.
- Signs? Nothing new. They're probably already creating plenty of signage.
- Stains? I'd assume it's already being done. Not necessarily red, but dirt textures to make the world more realistic has to be a given.
- Middle Ages stuff? Should be a given for any Thief game; shouldn't take a doubling of the team to do something they're probably already doing.

Jrt7 wrote: Thief's not medieval

My interpretation of Thief is that it has medieval and middle ages stuff & influences. I think many people feel the same. When I see castles, towers, swords, decorative guards, helmets, torches, torture devices, stone walls, bow & arrows and dungeons, I don't exactly think of the 21st century or other time periods. By my definition, these things are "medieval"... but I'm not a historian. It's what I know from casual observation. So if the dictionary or history books say different things existed in the middle ages or medieval times, then that's fine. I've just always thought they were medieval, and we'd be talking semantics at that point. No matter if Thief has medieval influences or not, the common sentiment, imo, is that the above things are medieval. If they're instead of some "Stone Age," "Renaissance," "Industrial Age", or other time period, then so be it. And I don't think anyone would say the medieval in Thief is entirely medieval, considering there's hi-tech and magic stuff going on at the same time. I guess I'm curious: what do you mean by saying Thief's not medieval? Guess I should've asked this before writing... but I had the time to share my thoughts at this time.

[Flashart]

I think of it as Tudor styling with Victorian technology. But as a catchall then Medieval seems fine to me.

[Hypevosa]

medieval steampunk.

But yes, Tudor with Victorian tech does sound like a good description as well, lets not forget that it's just a bit of scifi that turns Victorian into steampunk.