"THE ARMOURY: Tools of Your Trade" - Weapons/Equipment Discussion Thread

[Platinumoxicity]

I though of this: If there's a "Bonehoard 2.0" or some other cave-exploring mission, there could be "Rock-climbing arrows". Much like rope arrows, but you could shoot them into rock and they would be single-use, so you would really need to plan how you're going to use them.

[Flashart]

Sort of "grappling hook"? I thought of this instead of climbing gloves, (ie a way of climbing up a flat "static" surface, and assuming rope arrows were unavailable/usable.Or used horizontally as a zip-wire).

I also thought of a slightly different version of a gas arrow. Something like a "Smoke Arrow" or "CS Arrow" able to confine a guard(s) to one space for say 10-15 secs. (Like a flashbomb, but at distance) You'd use it for say interrupting the regular pattern of a patrol, or confining a group in a guardhouse. Or you could use it to quickly sneak by, Garrett would be unaffected as his mechanical eye would guide him. I was thinking about it only alerting the guards slightly, as if they were just walking along and accidentally got something in their eye.

[BlooferLady]

about rock-climbing arrows: If you're just looking for a rope arrow that would stick to a rock surface, didn't vine arrows do that? I think you could retrieve them, though. Can't remember.

[kamuraki]

I see I'm not the only one who missed my rope/vine arrows in Thief 3.

[Platinumoxicity]

Originally Posted by BlooferLady

about rock-climbing arrows: If you're just looking for a rope arrow that would stick to a rock surface, didn't vine arrows do that? I think you could retrieve them, though. Can't remember.

Vine arrows could be shot to wooden surfaces as well as metal grates and they were retrievable. They couldn't be shot to rock surfaces though.

The rock-climbing arrows would stick into rock and expand so that they stay where they are. They couldn't be retrieved so you couldn't use them in regular missions to climb anywhere.

[Flashart]

Or perhaps have you using a moss arrow then a vine arrow, that would stick to most surfaces. Make them unretrievable so it's nice and expensive to do.

[DarthEnder]

Originally Posted by Flashart

Or perhaps have you using a moss arrow then a vine arrow, that would stick to most surfaces. Make them unretrievable so it's nice and expensive to do.

Neat!

[esme]

Originally Posted by Flashart

Or perhaps have you using a moss arrow then a vine arrow, that would stick to most surfaces. Make them unretrievable so it's nice and expensive to do.

so you shoot the rock with a mossie, which spreads over the rock surface, then shoot a vine arrow into the moss patch .... intriguing idea

hmm one thought, one trick I do sometimes, if I can't get a straight shot at a tiled surface with a moss arrow, say I'm on a stairway and the clear shot puts me in view for too long, I stay concealed and shoot a moss arrow at the ceiling, this then drops onto the tiled floor and spreads so I can run across with no noise and deal with the AI

your trick would pretty much kill that

how about 50% of the moss spreads where the arrow hitsand the rest drops vertically to the nearest surface under the hit point and that spreads as normal ?

[Platinumoxicity]

On the graphical side, now that we're talking about moss arrows, I don't want those "moss vine blobs" floating over the floor. We have steep parallax mapping today, so the moss could work this way:
1. The arrow hits the floor, a few spores fly out
2. It analyzes the surface's bump mapping structure and grows more moss in the cracks and lower places.
3. It grows to a reasonbale area like in T1 and the distant parts from the center are just that green texture in the cracks of the bump mapping, but do not effect your footsteps' noise level anymore.
4. Steep parallax mapping creates the illusion that the moss is 3d and sticks out of the ground.

-No 3d models used, just texture. It could look cool

[DarthEnder]

Yeah, the blobs sucked because it was impossible to eyeball the edges of the moss patch.

[LightWarriorK]

Personally, I'd love to see upgradable lockpicks.

It's nice that there's a little minigame, like in TDS, based on the type of lock. I would just like to see locks that NO MATTER how good you are, you can't open with a cheap set.

Of course, that'd force a more open-ended game, since you'd have to be able to return to areas you've been to before and couldn't open. I think it'd be extremely cool, however, that maybe there's a lock in the first mission that you CAN'T open, and it takes an obsenely expensive set of wire-thin top-of-the-line lockpicks to get.

That'd also give the ghosters something to root for, eh? Maybe these upper-end sets are so expensive that you can't be buying all the arrows and tools you want and still afford them, so some rooms can only be opened by the best of the best, ghosters or otherwise?

I would really enjoy that.

I'd also think that it'd be interesting if there would be the highest level set that could BREAK. If you fail to open the most intricate and toughest of the locks, and the picks snap, you just wasted tons of money on picks that you'll have to buy again! Of course, that's pure evil, so maybe not.

[Flashart]

I'd rather have everything I need (if I didn't already carry it) available with the level itself.
"Super-Picks" or expensive upgrades would be available but only to speed up the process (perhaps reduce the number of "pickable" tumblers).
However, I would like to see a lot of secrets or additional content that you really had to search for.
A ghoster's "reward".
I like the idea of spying through keyholes etc.

[hexhunter]

Originally Posted by esme

so you shoot the rock with a mossie, which spreads over the rock surface, then shoot a vine arrow into the moss patch .... intriguing idea

hmm one thought, one trick I do sometimes, if I can't get a straight shot at a tiled surface with a moss arrow, say I'm on a stairway and the clear shot puts me in view for too long, I stay concealed and shoot a moss arrow at the ceiling, this then drops onto the tiled floor and spreads so I can run across with no noise and deal with the AI

your trick would pretty much kill that

how about 50% of the moss spreads where the arrow hitsand the rest drops vertically to the nearest surface under the hit point and that spreads as normal ?

I had a few similar ideas, namely fungus arrows and plaster arrows, both of which would be designed so you could fire a rope arrow into them. This brings up an issue however that the devs couldn't stop you from getting somewhere if you had enough arrows. myself I'd prefer to play a game which doesn't limit you in such a way so I don't mind the ideas.

Originally Posted by DarthEnder

Yeah, the blobs sucked because it was impossible to eyeball the edges of the moss patch.

Couldn't moss patches be slightly luminescent to Garrett's mechanical eye? That brings up other uses for the eye, like marking objects with invisible dyes and paints. Then Platinum's idea wouldn't be too difficult...

[BlooferLady]

I don't know... I have to suspend reality enough to just imagine a mechanical eye that works at all, much less one with the full capacity of a C.S.I. team. I guess if you had magical add-ons. That's something to perhaps use your extra coinage on.

Not that his eye isn't one of the coolest things... EVER. I just don't want it to become his cyborg-swiss army knife.

[Nate]

I am withdrawing my earlier suggestion for Garrett to be able to purchase better weapons/armor/equipment/tools. 'Super' equipment/weapons would effectively make Thi4f an RPG style game = hard for devs to balance missions and city hub. Not to mention, Super items would either turn Garrett into an unstoppable Juggernaut of carnage OR grant him near invisibility.

Nobody wants to play Thi4f: God of War or Thi4f: The Invisible Man

ALL THAT SAID, I still want Garrett to have choices for how to equip himself.

For example, while at his apartment, he can choose to leave his dagger/short sword behind = TINY (~4%) stealth and speed advantage.

I'd also like the highest difficulty setting to seriously limit how many arrows/items he can carry.

[Platinumoxicity]

Speaking of his mechanical eye, sure, it's nice that it's black and white, not too many color tv's at that time. But you could hear Garrett using that thing from a mile away in TDS. This loud, strange alien humming and a zooming "whirr" that sounded more like someone reeling an anchor up in a steamship. It should have been subtle, or better yet, manually operated. Garrett should turn the zooming lenses with his fingers, so there would be different zooming levels, like in many sniper scopes today.

Originally Posted by Nate

For example, while at his apartment, he can choose to leave his dagger/short sword behind = TINY (~4%) stealth and speed advantage.

I don't think it's a good idea to make the seaking easier for those who want to generally make the gameplay more challenging. If someone wants to take a sword it only makes his gameplay easier if he decides to use it, but it shouldn't make it harder. Those who want genuine challenge won't use any tools. Those who want genuine FPS can take as many tools as they can afford. It's the second step in the difficulty choice. After you've decided in which boundaries the game let's you play it, you decide in which boundaries you let yourself play it.

[DarthEnder]

Originally Posted by Platinumoxicity

Speaking of his mechanical eye, sure, it's nice that it's black and white, not too many color tv's at that time. But you could hear Garrett using that thing from a mile away in TDS. This loud, strange alien humming and a zooming "whirr" that sounded more like someone reeling an anchor up in a steamship. It should have been subtle, or better yet, manually operated.

I just want to point out that the mechanical eye might not make any more noise than a pocket watch, and it only sounds loud because its...you know...inside Garrett's HEAD.

[Platinumoxicity]

Originally Posted by DarthEnder

I just want to point out that the mechanical eye might not make any more noise than a pocket watch, and it only sounds loud because its...you know...inside Garrett's HEAD.

Oh. Well... I guess... Yeah. I haven't had my mech eye functional for a long time so I don't remember. Eye patch is much cooler.

Okay, the zoom sound is explained but the alien hum that plays when you activate zoom mode is just wrong. It should play all the time then and irritate everyone. ...Or does Garrett deactivate the eye each time he's done zooming?

Eye patch btw is not cooler. I just can''t afford another mech eye! Boo-hoo...

[DarthEnder]

I think he should just stick The Eye in his head and see what awesome powers it gives him.

Plus, I'd love to just listen to the two of them make sarcastic comments at each other for the whole game.

[namron]

i cant think of any new items that are needed all the old items were good

but get rid of the climbing gloves and bring back the rope arrow and i think he should have a sword cos he was trained to use one and is useful if u do get into a fight stick with normal bows and not crossbows
food wen i find my old thief games ill play them and see what is needed

[Blade_hunter]

I wanted to make a thread about that but somebody show to me that one.

I just want to suggest two three items and see what persons thinks about it.


Weapons:
Caltrops
Throwing knives
Sword (return)

Arrows
Crack arrow (an arrow that leaves some gazes that can cover a very small area that can disorient guards during some seconds)
Rope and vine arrow (return)

I got an other Idea but I'm a bit affraid about the how much magical is it even if it doesn't do any damage ...

[Hypevosa]

Originally Posted by Blade_hunter

I wanted to make a thread about that but somebody show to me that one.

I just want to suggest two three items and see what persons thinks about it.


Weapons:
Caltrops
Throwing knives
Sword (return)

Arrows
Crack arrow (an arrow that leaves some gazes that can cover a very small area that can disorient guards during some seconds)
Rope and vine arrow (return)

I got an other Idea but I'm a bit affraid about the how much magical is it even if it doesn't do any damage ...

I like the idea of the caltrops... however the throwing knives seems a little out there. Why not use my bow? it would be just as if not more deadly...

The in keeping with the spirit of elements in thief, I suggest your crack arrow be a thunder arrow instead. Flash bombs blind people, so why not have an item that instead deafens them? It makes sense to me, and sounds like a fun idea.

Let's hear your other idea, I'm sure as long as it's not something like a fireball then people wouldn't object instantly.

[Master Taffer]

I'de like the non-lethal mines to return, myself. I recall setting an ambush for Cavador went really well for me in Thief 2 because I took the time to set up a proper ambush with these mines.

[Platinumoxicity]

Originally Posted by Master Taffer

I'de like the non-lethal mines to return, myself. I recall setting an ambush for Cavador went really well for me in Thief 2 because I took the time to set up a proper ambush with these mines.

The mines could work in 2 ways. If you press "r" to drop it, it arms it like a mine. But... if you press "m2" to throw it, it arms with a timer so you can slide in under a door and the gas fills the room on the other side and knocks out anyone in there. Then you have to wait a moment before entering.

[Flashart]

I thought maybe a blowpipe and darts, perhaps a "20 sec knockout" fainting dart and
a permanent "toxic" poison dart, for those that like death.