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  #1  
Old 11-11-2008, 07:43 PM
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Divine Shadow Divine Shadow is offline
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Default Legacy of Kain: The Dark Prophecy (Cancelled)

After reading Rabban's post regarding a cancelled LOK game, I decided to perform some research of my own. Brace yourselves...


(click image to enlarge)


(click image to enlarge)]

By investigating my way through the websites of game artist Aaron Hausmann, artist and animator Ranjeet Singhal, and the website of artist Jason Muck, I've managed to establish that Crystal Dynamics were six months into production of a game called Legacy of Kain - The Dark Prophecy before the project was cancelled by Eidos.



























The game seems to have been much further along than I had anticipated before it was cancelled. The premise appears to involve Kain between his Blood Omen 2 Warlord, and Soul Reaver Dark-God states.

Damn, I would have played this game!

I created a topic on Neogaf for my discoveries, and thought I'd share them here.

Last edited by Umah Bloodomen; 07-26-2010 at 11:59 AM. Reason: Changed images to thumbnail so as to not distort the forum layout.
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  #2  
Old 11-11-2008, 08:54 PM
Gribbix Gribbix is offline
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Nice detective work. I saw that post at Neogaf and decided to come pay this forum (and the NR forum) a visit after a long hiatus. I lurked at both forums for a long time. This is my first time posting.
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  #3  
Old 11-11-2008, 10:32 PM
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Um, can someone please explain to me why all of these screens are nothing but fan compilations (the larger above shots) seen many times before and the smaller ones simple compilations of Kain from Defiance with the same health bar, etc., mixed with similar screens from Defiance and other games?

We know of Photoshop and other various software. At least, I do. If it's the intention of this to be an early April Fool's joke, it failed, miserably.

Now, if you have proof of something, why in the hell would you post these obvious fake screens??

Sad.
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  #4  
Old 11-11-2008, 10:51 PM
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Divine Shadow Divine Shadow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hylden View Post
Um, can someone please explain to me why all of these screens are nothing but fan compilations (the larger above shots) seen many times before and the smaller ones simple compilations of Kain from Defiance with the same health bar, etc., mixed with similar screens from Defiance and other games?

We know of Photoshop and other various software. At least, I do. If it's the intention of this to be an early April Fool's joke, it failed, miserably.

Now, if you have proof of something, why in the hell would you post these obvious fake screens??

Sad.
So, let me get this straight. In order to fool the few Legacy of Kain fans who still visit this forum, I did the following:

1. I registered and paid for three different websites, and set them up in vastly different styles. Accompanying each of these three websites is a fake email address to help reinforce my deception.

2. I commited mass identity fraud, by pretending to be individuals on the Defiance team, up to and including making a fake CV for each of them.

3. I somehow with no programming experience, manage to hack the Defiance engine, creating new models and environments, and put them into the game, for the express purpose of taking low-quality screenshots.

4. I learned a degree of Photoshop skill that, somehow, can make brand new environments out of nothing. A skill so far undiscovered by the rest of humanity.

If you truly believe that, then you are not worth my time. If however you have come to your senses, an apology for calling me 'sad' would be acceptable.
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Old 11-11-2008, 10:53 PM
Gribbix Gribbix is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hylden View Post
Um, can someone please explain to me why all of these screens are nothing but fan compilations (the larger above shots) seen many times before and the smaller ones simple compilations of Kain from Defiance with the same health bar, etc., mixed with similar screens from Defiance and other games?

We know of Photoshop and other various software. At least, I do. If it's the intention of this to be an early April Fool's joke, it failed, miserably.

Now, if you have proof of something, why in the hell would you post these obvious fake screens??

Sad.
They aren't fakes. Click on the links. All three people worked at or were contracted by the same company, Ritual Entertainment. Are you honestly trying to suggest that Divine Shadow went through the trouble of paying for the domain names and forging three different websites along with all the different artwork/demo reels from various different games? These images are legit.

EDIT: Looks like Divine Shadow already covered it.
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  #6  
Old 11-11-2008, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gribbix View Post
Nice detective work. I saw that post at Neogaf and decided to come pay this forum (and the NR forum) a visit after a long hiatus. I lurked at both forums for a long time. This is my first time posting.
Thanks! I'm going to have a look through more of Eidos / CD's staff's websites and see if there are any more pieces of this lost game to discover!
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  #7  
Old 11-11-2008, 11:08 PM
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To Divine Shadow:

I'm not suggesting anything. I am TELLING you that these screen shots are OBVIOUS fakes. I never implied YOU, nor anyone else you are affiliated with made them, just that I've personally seen then for ages back on the NR forums -- the larger screens -- while the smaller ones are just Kain from Defiance mixed into warped Defiance areas, and other backgrounds. These. Are. Fakes.

You will get no apology. Not for wasting our time. If you found these on those sites and believed them, I am sorry that you've believed in the lie only, as it's not you're fault. If you are simply trying to pander the sites and these screens off to start something here, then I AM blaming you and your coincidental follower here entirely.

Yes.

And Ritual Entertainment means nothing. You know why? They've never EVER been affiliated with Eidos Interactive. Ever.

I'm no longer arguing this point. No-one will believe this crap on here, so if this is some lame attempt, as it seems to be, at causing a stir on here. It's finito.
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  #8  
Old 11-11-2008, 11:15 PM
Gribbix Gribbix is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hylden View Post

And Ritual Entertainment means nothing. You know why? They've never EVER been affiliated with Eidos Interactive. Ever.
Is that so? See this link ---> http://www.25tolife.com/. Click it. Tell me whose logo that is at the bottom right? Ritual Entertainment. Now who published this game? Eidos Interactive. Now go back and check the three 'forged' websites. All three of them worked at Ritual Entertainment and all three of them worked on 25 to Life.
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  #9  
Old 11-11-2008, 11:46 PM
Yautjatraker/Albatraous Yautjatraker/Albatraous is offline
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The Kain image from http://rungy.us/ I don't really think is real, simply because that website is very poorly put together, and has not been updated in ages. The guy is an artist, yet his website looks like it was put together by a school kid, especially the logo.

As for the rest of the screenshots, they look too good to be true. The texture details looks quite high, as do the quality of the models. If this was only a few months into development, I doubt they would be of this quality.

The main thing that doesn't sell it to me is the camera. It looks like a combination of a cinematic camera and a behind the person view. Possible, but I very much doubt it would have both of them.

A good find, but unless someone from Eidos can directly verify those were actual work in progress, I will remain sceptical.

I hope to be proved wrong, and those are going to be used (in some way) in the next game.
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  #10  
Old 11-12-2008, 01:37 AM
theextremepiercing theextremepiercing is offline
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The image with the BO2 Kain jumping about inside the Sarafan Stronghold is clearly fake.

I'm inclined to believe that the others are genuine, however. Granted, Kain's model and the HUD are exactly the same as in Defiance, but if you follow the development of games it's easy to think that these could just be placeholders (and SR2 used the same HUD as SR1 ).

Yautjatraker/Albatraous mentioned that the camera seems to be all over the place. This could easily be done by the programmers using debug menus. And I definitely don't think the screenshots are "too good to be true". It seems that this is just one area, that the programmers were able to design well. Unfortunately, they weren't able to design the rest of the game.

It seems natural that details would escape via programmers who are no longer affiliated with CD/Eidos.

EDIT: It couldn't hurt to speculate about the nature of some of these screenshots, could it?

There's no telling who the ice fortress belongs to; it's guarded by some sort of animated guards (Thralls?), and there's a Sarafan symbol mixed in with some statues of winged creatures.

Could the Hylden have something to do with the room with the massive metal faces?

Last edited by theextremepiercing; 11-12-2008 at 01:44 AM. Reason: Added thoughts on screenshots.
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  #11  
Old 11-12-2008, 03:56 AM
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are those fake? I thought they´re real...
I have never seen before those shots, nor the enviroment - are those statues hylden faces?
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  #12  
Old 11-12-2008, 04:18 AM
Balance Reaver Balance Reaver is offline
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I just don't know what to think about it.
But I don't understand something about those screens - why the Soul Reaver looks like the Blood Reaver? Shouldn’t the sword glow as it was at the end of Defiance?
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Old 11-12-2008, 05:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balance Reaver View Post
I just don't know what to think about it.
But I don't understand something about those screens - why the Soul Reaver looks like the Blood Reaver? Shouldn’t the sword glow as it was at the end of Defiance?
Probably because it's just a placeholder, if it is real.

But even if it is fake, those screenies look pretty awesome to me, unfinished as they are. Or maybe I'm getting desperate.
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Old 11-12-2008, 09:59 AM
blincoln blincoln is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hylden View Post
I'm not suggesting anything. I am TELLING you that these screen shots are OBVIOUS fakes. I never implied YOU, nor anyone else you are affiliated with made them, just that I've personally seen then for ages back on the NR forums -- the larger screens -- while the smaller ones are just Kain from Defiance mixed into warped Defiance areas, and other backgrounds. These. Are. Fakes.
The big one isn't a "fake", it's a mockup. When artists mock things up, they use the same tools as when fans make fake images.

The smaller ones are "Kain from Defiance mixed into... other backgrounds" because this work was done in the months after Defiance was released. Just like the first screenshots of Soul Reaver 2 were basically the Soul Reaver engine with different areas.

It's one thing to respectfully disagree with someone, but you're being incredibly rude *and* your argument is also weak. While I guess it's remotely possible that this is some elaborate viral marketing campaign that DS stumbled upon... years after it would have had any effect... Occam's Razor agrees with DS' assessment.
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Old 11-12-2008, 10:37 AM
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Oh, it's a "mock-up." Like I don't know what a mock-up is. The fact is, those screens were shown by someone on NR more than a year ago as a "Look what I did! I put BO2 Kain in Defiance!" Though of course the background is also a mock-up, or fake, and not mostly from Defiance either. The texture on the dais is, but little else. Seems funny to me that some artist claims then that these were just his own project, and you can clearly see it's just Kain from BO2, chopped up, and proportions stretched, with adjustments to the clothing, then suddenly now we're shown these images from some amateurish website of some guy, who's claiming to be a professional artist with this company, who created these screens. Furthermore, they were intended in a game that's set between BO2 and SR1's eras. Funny, considering the fan-base probably wouldn't respond to such a game in the first place. We're all mostly in agreement that first, and foremost, we'd love to see the end of Kain's story. Save the prequels, sub-plots, etc., for after that's done.

But beyond that, expecting anyone to believe that those images were intended for an actual game is ridiculous. The bigger ones. Adding the knowledge that, with my own eyes, I've seen these images as someone's proclaimed personal project before, makes it all the more ridiculous now.

Now, you can think me rude, blincoln. I really don't care. Anyone who debates with me on these forums knows that I debate fairly, take the time to listen and explain myself, etc., The only times I ever get short with people is when something is proposed that seems to be for the purpose of being ludicrous. Case in point. When first asking Divine Shadow up there to explain why the above images are fakes by another artist, look so fake, how they are supposed to be real, the answer I got was more than telling of something very wrong here. Instead of saying simply that's what he's found. Unless the website creator is lying, that's all he can go on, or something of that nature, he instead went into a 4 point dictation of how he's suddenly being accused of making the website himself for spam, making the images himself, making a false account to spam the board, etc., etc. Now, nowhere in my post did I ever accuse him of any of that.

In my experience in life, when someone gets so defensive they deny anything before even being accused, there's usually something majorly wrong. I also am most suspicious of some other account up there that just coincidentally appears taking his side. Oh yeah, I saw these and just happened to decide to start posting again.

I'm not suggesting this is some viral campaign. I am suggesting that it looks to be just what it is: something to stir the board up. To which, it seems to be something to hurt the hope many still have on here for a new game some day. Oh, sorry to tell you all, but I've come upon this evidence of a game that was 6 months in development right after Defiance, but Eidos pulled the plug. Guess there's no more hope. Sorry guys...

And fakes these are. I still say. My argument isn't any weaker than his in saying they are actual. Some guy on a website that doesn't look all that great stating they work for a company Eidos doesn't contract with to produce the LoK series doesn't hold much weight (yes, I see they helped make 25 to Life). Anything official coming down the pipeline from Eidos would. Chrystal Dynamics, from what I've heard from people on this board, was split into two. One team that worked on Tomb Raider: Anniversary and one that's doing Underworld. It would have been the team working on Anniversary that would have started any work on an LoK game. That's from the people here. Maybe they're mistaken...

And doing my own research, these screens look much like a mod for The Witcher. Same architecture, etc. Not to say they are from that game, but the screens are very similar.

Again, I do not get rude with people. I only get short when I believe something is being done for reasons that aren't right. I even explained in my post that if Divine Shadow simply came upon these and thinks they are accurate, I am not accusing him, specifically, of anything. But, the images aren't real. If I am proven wrong, and only then, I will certainly apologize.

Until then, and until something real and tangible from an official source pops up in the research, I do not enjoy seeing a thread made that has none. Again, the first images are fakes, which takes the steam out of any credibility for the rest, not that the images themselves aren't discrediting enough.

If anyone finds me rude, it's not my intent, but so be it. I'd rather defend the fandom by being so then see its hope deflated needlessly. I also will admit that I, unfortunately, have little trust in most anyone from NR.

This all being said, I stated in my LAST post that I was done arguing, meaning people can think what they will from here on out. And I stick by that.
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  #16  
Old 11-12-2008, 11:06 AM
blincoln blincoln is offline
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Person #1: Aaron Hausmann

IMDB credits for Medal of Honor: Airborne - credited as "environment artist: Ritual Entertainment Inc."

Person #2: Ranjeet Singhal

Wikipedia information for his former employer now credits him with working for Ritual.

Some other documentation of Ranjeet's long-running career in game-related art.

Person #3: Jason Muck

MobyGames credits for 25 to Life - credits him as an artist from Ritual.

Site #1:

Registrar: FastDomain Inc.
Provider Name....: BlueHost.Com
Provider Whois...: whois.bluehost.com
Provider Homepage: http://www.bluehost.com/

Domain Name: METHHAUS.COM

Created on..............: 2007-12-17 04:16:14 GMT
Expires on..............: 2010-01-17 19:24:39 GMT
Last modified on........: 2008-06-05 02:05:16 GMT

Registrant Info: (FAST-12922483)

Aaron Hausmann
[ Deleted for Privacy ]
Dallas, Texas 75206
United States
Phone: [ Deleted for Privacy ]
Fax..:
Email: hausmann_aaron@hotmail.com
Last modified: 2007-12-17 04:16:14 GMT

Administrative Info: (FAST-12922483)

Aaron Hausmann
[ Deleted for Privacy ]
Dallas, Texas 75206
United States
Phone: [ Deleted for Privacy ]
Fax..:
Email: hausmann_aaron@hotmail.com
Last modified: 2007-12-17 04:16:14 GMT

Technical Info: (FAST-12785240)
Attn: methhaus.com 1,500 GB Storage and 15,000 Monthly Bandwidth.
BlueHost.com- INC
1215 North Research Way Suite #Q 3500
** FREE DOMAIN REGISTRATION **
Hosting plans starting at ONLY $6.95 per month -
Orem, Utah 84097
United States
Phone: [ Deleted for Privacy ]
Fax..: [ Deleted for Privacy ]
Email: whois@bluehost.com
Last modified: 2008-04-03 22:35:44 GMT

Status: Locked

Domain servers in listed order:

NS1.BLUEHOST.COM
NS2.BLUEHOST.COM
=-=-=-=


Site #2:

Domain Name: RUNGY.US
Domain ID: D9086458-US
Sponsoring Registrar: GODADDY.COM, INC.
Sponsoring Registrar IANA ID: 146
Registrar URL (registration services): whois.godaddy.com
Domain Status: clientDeleteProhibited
Domain Status: clientRenewProhibited
Domain Status: clientTransferProhibited
Domain Status: clientUpdateProhibited
Registrant ID: GODA-015625630
Registrant Name: Godaddy Softwar domains for sa
Registrant Organization: Godaddy Software
Registrant Address1: 14455 N Hayden Rd
Registrant Address2: Suite 219
Registrant City: Scottsdale
Registrant State/Province: AZ
Registrant Postal Code: 85260
Registrant Country: United States
Registrant Country Code: US
Registrant Phone Number: +1.4805058800
Registrant Facsimile Number: +1.4805058844
Registrant Email: domains4sale@godaddy.com
Registrant Application Purpose: P3
Registrant Nexus Category: C11
Administrative Contact ID: GODA-215625630
Administrative Contact Name: Godaddy Softwar domains for sa
Administrative Contact Organization: Godaddy Software
Administrative Contact Address1: 14455 N Hayden Rd
Administrative Contact Address2: Suite 219
Administrative Contact City: Scottsdale
Administrative Contact State/Province: AZ
Administrative Contact Postal Code: 85260
Administrative Contact Country: United States
Administrative Contact Country Code: US
Administrative Contact Phone Number: +1.4805058800
Administrative Contact Facsimile Number: +1.4805058844
Administrative Contact Email: domains4sale@godaddy.com
Administrative Application Purpose: P3
Administrative Nexus Category: C11
Billing Contact ID: GODA-315625630
Billing Contact Name: Godaddy Softwar domains for sa
Billing Contact Organization: Godaddy Software
Billing Contact Address1: 14455 N Hayden Rd
Billing Contact Address2: Suite 219
Billing Contact City: Scottsdale
Billing Contact State/Province: AZ
Billing Contact Postal Code: 85260
Billing Contact Country: United States
Billing Contact Country Code: US
Billing Contact Phone Number: +1.4805058800
Billing Contact Facsimile Number: +1.4805058844
Billing Contact Email: domains4sale@godaddy.com
Billing Application Purpose: P3
Billing Nexus Category: C11
Technical Contact ID: GODA-115625630
Technical Contact Name: Godaddy Softwar domains for sa
Technical Contact Organization: Godaddy Software
Technical Contact Address1: 14455 N Hayden Rd
Technical Contact Address2: Suite 219
Technical Contact City: Scottsdale
Technical Contact State/Province: AZ
Technical Contact Postal Code: 85260
Technical Contact Country: United States
Technical Contact Country Code: US
Technical Contact Phone Number: +1.4805058800
Technical Contact Facsimile Number: +1.4805058844
Technical Contact Email: domains4sale@godaddy.com
Technical Application Purpose: P3
Technical Nexus Category: C11
Name Server: NS09.DOMAINCONTROL.COM
Name Server: NS10.DOMAINCONTROL.COM
Created by Registrar: GODADDY.COM, INC.
Last Updated by Registrar: GODADDY.COM, INC.
Domain Registration Date: Thu Dec 01 19:39:00 GMT 2005
Domain Expiration Date: Sun Nov 30 23:59:59 GMT 2008
Domain Last Updated Date: Fri Mar 28 17:15:37 GMT 2008


Site #3:

Registrant:
jasonmuck
[ Deleted for Privacy ]
Plano, TX 75024
US

Domain name: JASONMUCK.COM


Administrative Contact:
jasonmuck, jasonmuck jasonmuck@hotmail.com
[ Deleted for Privacy ]
Chantilly, VA 20151
US
[ Deleted for Privacy ]
Technical Contact:
Hostmaster, Ampira dns_tech@ampira.com
500 7th Avenue
15th Floor
'
New York, NY 10018
US
212 706 3000 Fax: 212 706 3100



Registration Service Provider:
Dotster, Inc., legal@dotster.com
360-449-5952
360-397-2699 (fax)
http://fortunecityhosting.com
This company may be contacted for domain login/passwords,
DNS/Nameserver changes, and general domain support questions.


Registrar of Record: TUCOWS, INC.
Record last updated on 18-Feb-2008.
Record expires on 05-Mar-2009.
Record created on 05-Mar-2003.

Registrar Domain Name Help Center:
http://domainhelp.tucows.com

Domain servers in listed order:
NS2.FORTUNECITY.NET
NS1.FORTUNECITY.NET

Conclusion

Note that both Aaron and Jason used their personal contact information for their domain registrations which includes addresses in Texas. What else is in Texas? Hmm, how about Ritual Entertainment?

So there are basically two scenarios here:

1 - Aaron, Ranjeet, and Jason work for/used to work for Ritual. Previous to working on 25 To Life for Eidos, Ritual briefly worked on a Legacy of Kain sequel which was canceled. Four years later, their resumes include some material from this project in their portfolio because they are artists and need to document their abilities.

2 - Divine Shadow and his mysterious cabal of internet ninja warriors decide to play a "November Fools!" joke on the Legacy of Kain fanbase by establishing contact information in Texas (DS would need ninja warriors for this because he lives in the UK), registering three domain names (with three different DNS registration services, hosted by three different ISPs) using the names of artists who actually work for Ritual, and creating entire fake portfolios for them. Oh, and don't forget to note that all of the domain names were registered between about 1 and 3 years ago. Internet ninja warriors start laying their traps well in advance!

I think you are confusing Ranjeet's mockup with something else, or mixing up the contents of the post it was in at NR. I have seen someone post it before, but not claiming it was something they had made themselves. I'd always seen it with the text that it was from a Kain project. If you have the actual post to refer to, please feel free to provide a link.

Last edited by blincoln; 11-12-2008 at 11:12 AM.
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  #17  
Old 11-12-2008, 11:20 AM
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Hm...

Well, I must be getting old before my time. No, you're right. I must be confusing this. Sucks, because I could have sworn someone posted it as I stated. But, I am not looking for the thread. The above credentials are enough and I have no desire to return to NR.

I humbly apologize, everyone who's viewed this thread. I appear to be very wrong here. I definitely apologize to Divine Shadow. My distrust got in the way of viewing your efforts as genuine. I also apologize to Gribbix for any insinuations I made toward you. This all just seemed, to borrow a line, too convenient. But, alas...

Oh, and I definitely apologize to you, blincoln, for making you go through the effort of posting all of that.

*sigh*

Well, now that I've made a fool of myself... Guess I will check more of this out...

Edit: Actually, that's not enough. I hate seeing when jerks on the NET do nothing but bash people, or argue in ways they wouldn't in real life -- i.e., like I've just done. I was acting like the very thing I so despise. I don't usually do that, even in a heated debate. I seriously apologize and hopefully I won't act this stupid again.

Last edited by The Hylden; 11-12-2008 at 11:34 AM.
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Old 11-12-2008, 11:43 AM
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i'd just like to point out that it was me who posted that link in the NR forums under the name fallenvvarrior, no biggie though just saying.
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  #19  
Old 11-12-2008, 11:49 AM
blincoln blincoln is offline
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You should never apologize for asking people to back up their statements. I'm glad you motivated me to double-check their backgrounds, because I'm sure you're not the only one who was skeptical. Skepticism is good - it keeps people like me on our toes.
It's just important to keep the debate civil . I'm not always the greatest at that myself, as you may have noticed in my reply.
Edit: also, if this were for a more current, high-profile game, it wouldn't have been out of the question that someone really did set up all that stuff as an elaborate viral marketing ploy.

Last edited by blincoln; 11-12-2008 at 12:06 PM.
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  #20  
Old 11-12-2008, 12:26 PM
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I hope we can get some more info of eidos about this.......
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  #21  
Old 11-12-2008, 12:59 PM
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Yeah, that was the problem. I not only wasn't civil, instead of just being skeptical, I flat-out dismissed it entirely right off the bat. Seeing those initial pics that I saw, had to have been, a year ago now as new evidence was partly the trigger for me, I think. As stated, I must be confused as to their original origin when they first showed up. Also, it's amazing how much info IMDb has for ... everything. I mean, I didn't even think to look up the names there. If it were the writer, director, voice cast, sure, but it seems even for games IMBd is amazingly thorough these days. I find it amusing, weird, interesting, funny, that IMDb is fast becoming the one-stop database to rule them all, on everything media-related.

Anyway, thanks, blincoln. And now that I am actually able to look at these without going "FAKE!!" I can note some things. On LJ, these are also posted and skepticism is there too. Someone suggested the caverns shown look like the ones from BO2, insinuating that's their source alone. However, that's clearly not it. It does seriously remind me of the screens for The Witcher, which has some really similar architecture to LoK in general and would fit right in. So, that's not a criticism. The caves look much like an updated version of The Oracle caves. Another thing that gave me pause was looking at some of the screens that seem to combine existing Defiance architecture and dressings. For instance, the ones with the Ancient statues. I mean, they can be place holders too, of course, but they look exactly the same as the statues bearing one of the three weapons Raziel took to activate the Water Temple portal. In fact, it looks like we're either back in Vorador's mansion, in the back of that little part behind the pool/portal to the Water Temple, mixed with half the circular part in Avernus Cathedral, or we are in a modified Avernus... It's strange.

The ones with Kain roaming about in the snow and the somewhat circular stone structure looks either like we're back in the Sarafan Keep again, or further into the Vampire Citadel. It's very similar, although perhaps these are entirely supposed to be different areas.

Then you have the Hylden-like face in the one room, looking to be adorned with some elaborate head dress. That's probably my favorite screen section. That statue looks heavily molded on the relief mural of the Hylden female from BO2. It would definitely be cool to travel this time to more ancient Hylden structures, as there would have to be some still left to be unearthed in Nosgoth...

However, most of this looks like perhaps either an early build of Defiance areas, or stuff even that was ultimately cut from the game, rather than stuff that's new. But, with the build apparently so early in development, it's impossible to know where they would have been going with this all. I will note that those do not look like thralls to me. They actually look like Hylden spirits manipulating suits of armor, much in the same fashion Malek roamed around as just a suit of armor. There's even a female warrior there with a pike, but all spirit and just her armor/clothing.

Anyway, it's interesting, nonetheless. Perhaps, though, if and when Eidos gets around to doing a proper sequel, they can update with something a little less like the same old stuff, which is kind of what I am seeing here. However, there are some cool additions. I don't know.
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  #22  
Old 11-12-2008, 02:02 PM
blincoln blincoln is offline
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Yeah, I had similar feelings about the content. I chalked it up to being after only three months' work, and by people who were (I think?) new to working on the series, so they were probably still getting a feel for things.
There is a theory posted over at the NR forums that the shots with the animated armour are from a revisited Malek's Bastion, which I thought was kind of a neat idea, but I see what you mean about the green glow - that does look like the Hylden in Defiance.
It is really hard to tell anything for sure from this handful of screenshots. I was thinking that given the two Kain models, maybe it would have been split between events in two alternating eras (one as the young Kain uncovering the "Dark Prophecy" and the other as him watching it unfold centuries later, I guess) instead of between two characters.
There were a number of rumours of various sequel concepts in the years after Defiance. I'd be curious to know if this was related to any of them, or something no one in the public knew about.
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  #23  
Old 11-12-2008, 05:37 PM
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Divine Shadow Divine Shadow is offline
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No problem, The Hylden, I accept your apology. I admit that I took your response to be rather abrasive and rude, but I was rather condescending back to you in my reply, for which I also apologise. We can forget all that now. Thanks for the defence, Gribbix and Ben, though I now do want my own "mysterious cabal of internet ninja warriors" and feel more boring without them.

It is nice to have clarity on what exactly happened to the mythical sequel. My responses to the limited information we have:

1) Given the artwork, I like Ben's suggestion of two Kain's as the controllable characters.

2) The gameplay appears to build on Defiance's style, possibly maintaining its increased focus on combat. Defiance certainly had its strengths, but I prefer exploration over any other game genre, and thus Blood Omen (with its 2D-Zelda freeworld) and Soul Reaver (the Metroid Prime of its era) are my favourites. Additionally, I didn't have the issues with Defiance's camera that a number of others did, but I do prefer a free-camera without the rather-abrubt changes in position. A free camera is always more intuitive for me.

3) The cave screenshots, with emphasis on snow and sunlight peering through cracks, instantly placed the Soul Reaver era in mind. The accompanying spike models are very reminiscent of the impalement spikes also belonging to that era. Given the planned development for Defiance, in which Kain returned to his dead empire, this could be a possible locale.

4) The other screenshots show areas with possible emphasis on Hylden-eque architecture. The apparently animated suits of armour are very Blood-Omen Sarafan, suggesting the possibility of Malek's Bastion.

5) I don't like the title. The Dark Prophecy sounds very bland, and I think I've had my fill of prophecies since the Scion of Balance.

I've been checking the portfolio sites of a number of other Ritual Entertainment staff, not much in the way of megatons. Though, on Reid Kimball's CV, he mentions the following:

Quote:

Unpublished Game with Eidos (XBOX, PS2)

* Created paper top-down view designs for singleplayer levels
* Implemented gameplay
Given the time he worked on this project at Rational, and the fact it is unpublished, there is a strong possibility of it being Dark Prophecy.

I wonder if Chris@Crystal is allowed to enlighten us on any of this. For that matter, does he even maintain a presence here?

Last edited by Divine Shadow; 11-12-2008 at 05:42 PM.
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  #24  
Old 11-12-2008, 06:59 PM
Gribbix Gribbix is offline
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That's alright, The Hylden. I apologize for my snide replies.

I'm really interested in learning more about this project. I'm guessing CD's involvement with this project was akin to how Tomb Raider Anniversary was developed. Judging by the credits section of that game, it appeared that CD did most of the design, animation, story, and art direction, but much of the programming and content creation was done by Buzz Monkey.
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  #25  
Old 11-12-2008, 07:51 PM
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Andarthiel Andarthiel is offline
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I like what I see in those screenshots. Pity it was never finished, I just want an end to the LoK story for crying out loud.
I especially liked the cave areas from those screenshots, and I think they need to bring back the camera rotation feature of SR1 that would make life easier.
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Last edited by Andarthiel; 11-21-2008 at 05:40 PM.
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