Kain's obvious overpowering on Raziel is not logical.

[LOK Worshiper]

In the beggining of SR2 Kain was making sure that Raziel would unquestionably chase him down. By explaining how Moebius told him how to use the time-streaming device, i mean.

The question is: in that cut scene Kain looked like he had full advantage, had expected the situation ( which he proves with the words "here you are at last " ), and with irritating arogance explained to Raziel the "stuff" he knows, while most calmy adjusting the time-device. When Raziel attacked , Kain deflected the attack with absurd ease. And after Raziel "cornered him to the wall, Kain kept his arrogant smile as though he was enjoing it, and with a simple( although impressive) jesture telekinesed Raziel away. Why on that time had Kain had such an obvious advantage over Raziel. Maybe because he expected and had prepared for the situation or hes simply strong? And in that case where does Raziel get the Streinght to fight him in Defiance, after his defeat ( when you play with Kain THE MUSIC IS GREAT WHEN YOU PLAY WITH RAZIEL/ KAIN BATTLE )

P.S How does raziel get teleklinetic abilitys in Defiance? he never showed any sighns of soon leraning that ability, while Kain
"officially" learns it in BO2 (from the witch) and even uses it to suck blood at distance?

[Smoke_Z]

I think the TK thing was something that Kain eventually developed naturally, it's just that he hadn't gained it by BO2. The Turelium and the Rahabim also gained tk ability. And I think the telekinetic feeding is just a feature of Nosgoth vampires.

And I think the strength difference is more of a plot device than any really explainable reason. Maybe in vampires, knowledge really is power, so after Raz has learned all that history, he becomes really strong. *joke*

[Validus]

Well, if Raziel had beaten down Kain in the chronoplast chamber, it wouldn't have been much of a story, would it? Like Smoke_Z had said.

As for the telekenesis, Raziel gained the tk projectiles from a Turelim in SR1.

[BigKevSexyMan]

The reason why Raziel is weaker in the beginning of SR2 is because:
1) Raziel isn't as experienced
2) Raziel didn't have the hylden to influence and "motivate" him more to kill kain
3) WB wasn't fully awakened
4) Raziel didn't have Turels TK
5) Raziel didn't have the variouse reaver upgrades.

[andy5421]

Originally posted by Smoke_Z
I think the telekinetic feeding is just a feature of Nosgoth vampires.

Ever since BO1 Kain has had some sort of TK ability

i call Kains bloodsucking "Light TK"

[rambo3]

The question is: in that cut scene Kain looked like he had full advantage, had expected the situation ( which he proves with the words "here you are at last " ), and with irritating arogance explained to Raziel the "stuff" he knows, while most calmy adjusting the time-device. When Raziel attacked , Kain deflected the attack with absurd ease. And after Raziel "cornered him to the wall, Kain kept his arrogant smile as though he was enjoing it, and with a simple( although impressive) jesture telekinesed Raziel away. Why on that time had Kain had such an obvious advantage over Raziel. Maybe because he expected and had prepared for the situation or hes simply strong? And in that case where does Raziel get the Streinght to fight him in Defiance, after his defeat ( when you play with Kain THE MUSIC IS GREAT WHEN YOU PLAY WITH RAZIEL/ KAIN BATTLE )

Maybe in SR2, but that's just a cutscene, in the whole scene in SR1 Kain nearly gets his butt kicked by Raziel. That's why he says "you nearly had me Raziel".

[TheWatcher]

Gotta agree with Rambo3 here. With the exception of their fight at the Temple of the Clans, Raziel hadn't seen Kain in centuries and I think was unprepared for how strong Kain was (I imagine they had never fought before the abyss). Also a little reluctant to go full throw-down with the master he had feared for a millenia. I think once he realized he wasn't going to talk Kain into regretting anything, he decided to really turn it on.

Another thing (Wrong forum, but here goes). In the Temple of the Clans fight, Kain just towers over Raz. I mean he's like three feet taller than Raziel, which is way out of proportion to the rest of the series!

[Umah Bloodomen]

rambo3 ~ Please take the time to review the Forum Rules & Other Issues of Importance as soon as it is convenient for you to do so. (Especially the aspect regarding swearing and forum censor circumvention).

Your post has been edited to comply with what that thread entails accordingly.

Thanks.

[phantom08642]

the thing is, kain is THOUSANDS of years older than Razimataz and would really have no problem dispatching him in a hand to hand combat situation, but when razi uses the reaver, he is just as, if not more powerful than kain, i could say a little more but if you havn't played Defiance through to the end i will give away so much.. so i'll keep that to myself unless you really ask me for it

[Fury]

True but Raziel is not a Vampire any more, remember the Elder god told Raziel, 'His strength surpass's what it was in life' so when Raziel was changed into a wraith he got an upgrade.

Also remember Raziel is destined to kill Kain therefore he can't be weaker than him. He has to be at the same level of strength (if not more) than Kain.

[phantom08642]

You got a point there buddy, but the thing is, also, even though rizi kinda got an "Upgrade" as you put it he came back stronger, but the thing is, raziel came back stronger but while raz was floatin around in the lake kain was still alive and therefor growing in power everyday for the hundreds of years in raziels abscence making him SO much more powerful, i mean, in blood omen 2 do you recal "lore". kain feeded obviously everyday for hundreds of years while razimataz was KO'd so with each "meal" he grew in power, see the method behind my madness now.

[leazy]

Perhaps Raziel's connection to the Elder God helped him out with some extra strength, plus, kain was reluctant to fight raziel in defiance, so he wouldn't have given it his all.