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Thread: very hard difficulty like purist in hitman absolution is fun!!!

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    Exclamation very hard difficulty like purist in hitman absolution is fun!!!

    Hard difficulties like purist in absolution are very important
    Im one of the players that who like playing game on hardest possible difficulty.
    Purist was perfect difficulty that maked you fell you are 47!!!
    No map,no seeing guards from behind wall by instict,fast detecting enemis no showing your score.even if you know all the map and where the targets go and where the guards are moving around you will die trying.oh i forgot...the number of guards increased in purist difficulty.
    we want all of developers to make this difficulty in next hitman games.

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    The number of guards is nor increased on Purist, nor is anything else. The only difference between Expert and Purist is that on Purist you can't see the hud, which I don't think has any reason to be its own difficulty level.

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    I'm not commenting on Purist because I never played it. I do like the difficulty customization from Absolution, though. A problem I had with older Hitman games is that you were not allowed to play on Professional and save at the same time. That to me was kind of an oxymoron. Not being able to save on the the hardest difficulty. Hard allowed you to save 3 times while still showing everything on the map. I think, having the option of turning off Agency assistance on normal mode would be more ideal.

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    My take on what the hardest (realistic) difficulty should be:

    -no map
    -guards become more suspicious and see through your disguise faster (almost H2 level)
    -blood effects, etc. play a much larger role
    -EDIT: guard checkpoints are set up if the alarm is raised
    -only a few saves
    -target will leave the map if too much attention is drawn
    Last edited by Adrian Shephard; 10-11-2014 at 08:42 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian Shephard View Post
    My take on what the hardest (realistic) difficulty should be:

    -no map
    -guards become more suspicious and see through your disguise faster (almost H2 level)
    -blood effects, etc. play a much larger role
    -checkpoints are set up if the alarm is raised
    -only a few saves
    -target will leave the map if too much attention is drawn
    With saves already being limited, I don't think we need to introduce checkpoints into this environment. Checkpoints are terrible, because they force the player to repeat unnecessary portions of the level over and over again (going from point A to point B, etc). We already know certain pieces of the puzzle are hard, we don't need to repeat irrelevant portions over and over again. The manual save system in Hitman and Splinter Cell are most ideal. If anything, the hardest mode in Hitman should play almost identical to Splinter Cell, but checkpoints don't belong in a Hitman game.

    Also, the blood effects are an interesting idea and shouldn't be limited to the hard mode. This is another feature that should be customizable, if anyone is crazy enough to be against it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent_69 View Post
    With saves already being limited, I don't think we need to introduce checkpoints into this environment.
    Sorry, I wasn't articulate enough. I meant guard checkpoints. I got the idea from Splinter Cell Chaos Theory; when enough alarms were raised, checkpoints would be set up making it harder to go undetected. I think something similar could be done here to make it harder instead of just raising the baddie count like most games do.
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    Touché!

    Alright.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent_69 View Post
    A problem I had with older Hitman games is that you were not allowed to play on Professional and save at the same time. That to me was kind of an oxymoron. Not being able to save on the the hardest difficulty.
    Well I think that's mostly why Professional is the hardest difficulty setting. Because you can't save, you have to ace it. That's the way it should be in my opinion.

    Rookie - Infinite saves
    Normal - Many saves (5-7)
    Expert - Some saves (2-3)
    Professional - No saves

    I liked it.

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    The hardest difficulty should represent the most realistic gameplay. So: no saves, highest AI possible (but realistic), even no HUD (i liked this thing in Abso). After beating game on this difficulty, game should unlock custom difficulty, where you can set your own specific options, like AI's range of vision, AI's memory (it would be cool if they implement it), damage level, ammount of saves etc.

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    There should be a mode that combines no map with saves, is all I'm trying to say.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent_69 View Post
    There should be a mode that combines no map with saves, is all I'm trying to say.
    Maybe we could adjust the difficulty ourselves with sliders? Somewhat like kewlak suggested, but it would be open from the very beginning. Sliders for

    - Amount of guards: Minimal / Normal / Maximum
    - AI awareness: Blind as a mole / Normal / Suspicious / All seeing dickwad
    - Amount of saves: 0-5 or infinite
    - Map icons:
    * Points of interest on/off
    * Guards on/off
    * HUD on/off
    * Target on/off

    There'd also be the preset difficulties of Rookie, Normal, Expert and Professional just like before and they'd set the sliders automatically since not everyone wants to customise their experience. Professional would naturally be the hardest setting and everything (but HUD imo) turned off.

    Just my two cents.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aybroe View Post
    Maybe we could adjust the difficulty ourselves with sliders? Somewhat like kewlak suggested, but it would be open from the very beginning. Sliders for

    - Amount of guards: Minimal / Normal / Maximum
    - AI awareness: Blind as a mole / Normal / Suspicious / All seeing dickwad
    - Amount of saves: 0-5 or infinite
    - Map icons:
    * Points of interest on/off
    * Guards on/off
    * HUD on/off
    * Target on/off

    There'd also be the preset difficulties of Rookie, Normal, Expert and Professional just like before and they'd set the sliders automatically since not everyone wants to customise their experience. Professional would naturally be the hardest setting and everything (but HUD imo) turned off.

    Just my two cents.
    No offense, but some of those ideas are terrible. I guess it could work but turning Hitman into Burger King: Have It Your Way is kind of a tall order. The only issue I've ever had with Hitman is not being able to turn off NPC's on the map while playing on Normal. I want to be able to experiment and play with the world without having to repeat myself so much. I was just playing Assassin's Creed IV, and there's this mission that doesn't pick up in difficulty until the very end. The problem is if you want to get through it undetected you're going to lose a lot, and repeating the first 2 thirds of it over and over is a real drag. This is why I think we should just be able to turn off agency assistance on any difficulty mode. I think a lot of people like playing without NPCs or POIs on the map but taking away the ability to save kind of breaks the game. The hardest mode should be fixed, no question about that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent_69 View Post
    No offense, but some of those ideas are terrible. I guess it could work but turning Hitman into Burger King: Have It Your Way is kind of a tall order.
    None taken. It does seem a bit forced, I was just trying to figure out how'd you get to play Professional with saves or Normal without NPC's on map and thought of other possible variables aswell. I'm totally fine with the difficulty settings in all current Hitman games, except Purist in Absolution is somewhat glued on.

    The problem is if you want to get through it undetected you're going to lose a lot, and repeating the first 2 thirds of it over and over is a real drag. This is why I think we should just be able to turn off agency assistance on any difficulty mode. I think a lot of people like playing without NPCs or POIs on the map but taking away the ability to save kind of breaks the game. The hardest mode should be fixed, no question about that.
    I have to disagree. One giant factor that makes Hitman for me is tension. Which was partially lost already in Blood Money, since the guards are so freakishly stupid. But my point is, you go all that trouble (the first two thirds of the level) and then when you are supposed to do the final hit there's pressure. Pressure of the hit succeeding without anyone noticing. Fail, and it's all over again. Allowing saving would let you try the same part over and over again without the fear of *** up. The feeling once you finally manage to complete the level without saving is also much more rewarding than "tried the same part fifteen times and then ran to the exit." Besides, Hitman levels aren't really that long.

    I think it should be a no-brainer that the hardest difficulty setting doesn't let you save.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aybroe View Post
    None taken. It does seem a bit forced, I was just trying to figure out how'd you get to play Professional with saves or Normal without NPC's on map and thought of other possible variables aswell. I'm totally fine with the difficulty settings in all current Hitman games, except Purist in Absolution is somewhat glued on.


    I have to disagree. One giant factor that makes Hitman for me is tension. Which was partially lost already in Blood Money, since the guards are so freakishly stupid. But my point is, you go all that trouble (the first two thirds of the level) and then when you are supposed to do the final hit there's pressure. Pressure of the hit succeeding without anyone noticing. Fail, and it's all over again. Allowing saving would let you try the same part over and over again without the fear of *** up. The feeling once you finally manage to complete the level without saving is also much more rewarding than "tried the same part fifteen times and then ran to the exit." Besides, Hitman levels aren't really that long.

    I think it should be a no-brainer that the hardest difficulty setting doesn't let you save.
    I understand what your saying but I suck at video games . Besides, with manual saving, there's also a limit and the risk that you forget to save. So it's not all easy. Hard mode only allows 3 saves. I think manual saving just allows the game to move forward in a reasonable fashion. To me, Hitman is about exploring and tinkering around with the world. Obtaining Silent Assassin on every mission with 7 saves is hard enough (looking at you Jacuzzi Party), Silent Assassin with the difficulty turned all the way up, no saves and no map assistance is just damn near impossible.

    I think the option to turn off agency assistance on normal mode should be included for the less-than hardcore gamers. And there should be incentives for beating the game on the hardest difficulty.

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    There definitely should be options included to create your own difficulty level (which includes the option to save). However, for leaderboard purposes, I think saving should be left out of the preset hardest difficulty. That way, the hardcore gamers that don't save can be ranked fairly against similar players without having the non-save crowd screw up the global/individual score.

    So if you choose to make your own difficulty, your score shouldn't be officially recorded for the world.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian Shephard View Post
    However, for leaderboard purposes, I think saving should be left out of the preset hardest difficulty. That way, the hardcore gamers that don't save can be ranked fairly against similar players without having the non-save crowd screw up the global/individual score.
    Why should there be a leaderboard and what should it track? From what I've seen the majority of people didn't like the way Absolution tracked scores and I don't see how a scoring system like that would add anything to the game, even if improved. When the game rewards you more for doing certain things over others it encourages playing in a specific way and takes away from the freedom of choice. Sure, you can still do what you want but the game is giving you the message that you're playing it wrong.

    Blood Money also had leaderbord which as an idea I preferred (as a speedrunner I'm biased) but unfortunately it was completely overtaken by cheaters and very limited as it only tracked the time.

    Also IO, showing the time after completing a level is cool. I wish Absolution had that. I know there is is a proper timer as Contracts mode uses it but it would be nice to have that when playing the levels normally like in the older games. An accurate timer always gets a big thumbs up from speedrunners and shouldn't be difficult to implement.

    EDIT:
    Sorry for slipping off topic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kotti View Post
    Why should there be a leaderboard and what should it track? From what I've seen the majority of people didn't like the way Absolution tracked scores and I don't see how a scoring system like that would add anything to the game, even if improved.
    I assume the leaderboard will be back, whether that's in the form of money earned or just a total of small scores that are added up in the end. You constructed a good portion of your post on the assumption that the scoring system will be like the one in Absolution. I'm fine with a scoring system as long as IO does it right. You technically are already scored in the older games (you know this because there is some leeway in getting Silent Assassin), but it's not translated into a raw number.

    A very rudimentary system would be:
    Get detected/witness: 3 points
    Kill a guard: 1 point
    Kill innocent: 2 points
    Body found: 2 points
    Alarm raised: 3 points
    Shots fired: .5 points

    For Silent Assassin Rating, you need 3 points or below.
    Again, this is extremely rough but this should be enough to get my point across. I'm positive there was something like this in Contracts. IO can show us the number that is already tallied and call it our "raw score". The time component can be added in with some sort of formula so the score can scale properly. In the end, it will come down to the time factor, but the player still needs to be careful to not kill anyone unnecessarily/leave witnesses for the optimum score.

    The problem I had with Absolution scoring is that, apart from the stupid "spotted" moments before you shoot someone in the face, you got penalized for mild things like knocking someone out. Some methods were prioritized over others as well, so accidents guaranteed a higher score than if you killed the old fashion way. I don't see a reason why anyone would be opposed to the way I describe since it was in all of the previous games in one form or another.
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    What you describes is pretty much the rating system from Hitman 2 and Contracts which is fine for that purpose but fails for leaderboard purposes for the same reason as Absolution's system. When you dictate which actions affect your score there is bound to be a winning strategy and the top of the leaderboard is going to be a bunch of people with the same score.

    This might just be the speedrunner in me talking but I can not think of a value to track other than the time that doesn't directly restrict your actions and you as well said that in the end it's going to come down to time. To me, an ideal leaderboard would track nothing but time but would have a number of filters on it (difficulty level, SA, suit only, shots fired...) that you could apply to see the parts that interest you. That would give you the option to play competitively and more importantly you could set the rules under which you compete in. A system like that would make it possible to compete in pure speed or PRO/SA+no guns+suit only+no knockouts+one hand tied behind back or anything in between depending on what you find interesting.

    The more I think about the system the more I'd like to see it implemented. I think freedom is a huge part of Hitman and that's something that shows in the speedrunning scene. People have done crazy and impressive runs using restrictions like fire extinguisher only but something like that would never show in a leaderboard like Absolution's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aybroe View Post
    Well I think that's mostly why Professional is the hardest difficulty setting. Because you can't save, you have to ace it. That's the way it should be in my opinion.

    Rookie - Infinite saves
    Normal - Many saves (5-7)
    Expert - Some saves (2-3)
    Professional - No saves

    I liked it.
    Me too. I really liked the no save on Professional.

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