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Thread: The Doctor Who Thread

  1. #1

    Default The Doctor Who Thread

    Zoo Boy's idea, but it's a darn good one!

    This thread is for all thoughts & discussions about Doctor Who.

    ***

    Kicking off, I'm going to do what is possibly the most contentious thing any Whovian can do: put the Doctors in order of my personal preference!

    1. Tom Baker. With Troughton's charm and Pertwee's authority, Baker was the perfection of the form. No Doctor before or since has ever quite managed to blend the two so completely. Mostly good to great companions and a lot of time in the role helped.

    2. Matt Smith. A superb character actor, Smith can be flamboyant and subtle at the same time. Very much the old man in a young man's body, he has a lot of great stories and some terrific companions, but it's Smith himself who sells the idea of the Doctor as someone who would like to be human, but is not. Has the charm, but lacks authority.

    3. Jon Pertwee. The action Doctor! Pertwee's Doctor gets into more fights, car chases and general mayhem than all the rest put together, probably. As a master of Venusian Aikido, this Doctor is no pushover! All of his companions are great and Pertwee has both charm and authority in abundance. The last of the great villains - The Master - first appeared in his run.

    4. Patrick Troughton. The Cosmic hobo. It is a source of great sadness to me that the BBC managed to lose so much of Troughton's run, as every story I've seen with him in is excellent. Most of his companions are good, and Troughton himself has charm in abundance, though he rather lacks the authority. This Doctor tends to muddle through by the skin of his teeth.

    5. David Tennant. Companions range from the great to the godawful, as do Tennant's stories, which costs him a higher place. A terrific actor, with a lot of charm and enough authority to carry the role, Tennant has featured in some of the best stories of the new era - and some of the worst.

    6. Christopher Ecclestone. One season, which established how great a Doctor Ecclestone was. Unfortunately, he then left. While I loved Ecclestone's Doctor, I could not place him higher on the strength of a single season. Very charming, but not very authoritative.

    7. Sylvester McCoy. At his best, a sneaky, conniving, Machiavellian swine who had won before the game had even begun. Unfortunately, it took a while to get to that McCoy, with many of his earlier stories being poor. Not helped by the fact that the BBC had it in for Doctor Who at that time. Has one great companion and one who is really bad. Not really charming or authoritative, just sneaky.

    8. Colin Baker. Baker had a lot of charm and authority, and his performance was incredibly flamboyant. His stories weren't always very good, though, which is a shame.

    9. Peter Davison. Davison had charm but no authority, and often came off as rather bland, as did his companions. What was worse, the BBC were in full on delusional mode with regards to the FX they could render, resulting in some truly painful stories.

    10. William Hartnell. The first Doctor was more a tour guide for his companions for much of his run than the lead, and while he had both charm and authority, I don't think the BBC had really grasped just what they could do with the idea of a time travelling protagonist yet. Nonetheless, Hartnell has some great stories. I just never warmed to his Doctor, who always seemed very self centred in the stories I've seen.

    11. Paul McGann. One dreadful tele-movie and a five minute short means I can't really place McGann other than on the bottom, but from the short, oh what a great Doctor he could have been!

    As a final note, I would like to add that there are no bad Doctors, but there have been many terrible stories and a few dreadful companions.
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    I would guess that you started watching Dr Who when Tom Baker was the Doctor?

    I have found that most people rate the first Doctor they saw the highest.

    I would agree that there hasn't been a bad Doctor so far but, for me, Hartnell will always be Number One.

    Guess when I started watching.
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  3. #3

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    Hmmm... Tough one...

    I did indeed start watching during Tom Baker's run. I didn't discover Pertwee or Troughton till much later, but they instantly leap-frogged over all the later Doctors. I thought nothing would shift my top three, until I realised just how badly I was going to miss Matt Smith. I'm not ready for him to leave, even though he's now gone! No other Doctor leaving has ever affected me like that.

    Tom Baker, I do not THINK is unassailable in my top spot, but he is a very, very hard act to beat. It's certainly possible that I may be suffering from 'First Doctor' syndrome, as so many Whovians do. Tom Baker is my Doctor
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    I'm going to repost my Doctor Who posts from the other thread here so in case anyone who vists this thread can see it and discuss it.

    I've only seen NuWho (although I've been meaning to watch some of the classics on Netflix), so my favorites are Tennant and Smith. It is very close though, Smith is just shy of matching Tennant. What's interesting is I absolutely hated that first scene with Smith, so I did not have high hopes for him at all. Which is why I now am very optimistic with Capaldi.

    Donna Noble is one of my favorite companions. Especially towards the end of her run with Tennant. I did not like Martha, however. Rose was great, if a little bit too lovey-dovey with The Doctor.

    I also very much enjoyed the "Time Lord victorious" (as in The End of Time, which had it's problems, but I still loved it), where Tennant feels as how he can beat the Laws of Time, but I like the consequences even more.

    My favorite aspects of Tennant though is how he could go from very goofy to very serious in the blink of an eye. I like The Doctor to be very dark, something I thought Matt Smith did very well in the end of his run. I quite enjoyed Tennant's ruthlessness, yet at the same time. in a way, he was the most forgiving and hated killing. But at times, he lost control, such as with the Family of Mine, the Sycorax, and the Racnoss.

    I also love when The Doctor uses his name as a threat, like when Ten does to the Vashta Nerada in "The Library" (fantastic episode) or when Smith does that in his first episode. That's when I decided that not only did I like him, but that he was a worthy successor to Tennant's Doctor.

    The Girl in the Fireplace is my favorite Doctor Who episode. Don't know how many times I've watched that. I only wish Madame de Pompadour was a full, season long companion. Screw history.

    Blink is my second favorite episode, which as I always found ironic, as The Doctor is hardly in it. Brilliant writing on Moffat's part.
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    Oh it's good to see a Doctor Who thread here as well.

    I don't think I was a fan prior to the new series'. I don't remember watching it and can't recall any of the episodes although I know I was aware of it, with Peter Davidson's celery and K9 etc.

    My favourite 'new' doctor is David Tenant, though Matt Smith did an excellent job of portraying that old eccentric type yet he had so much energy and was almost elastic in movements.

    Donna Noble was refreshing as they avoided the whole crush thing that's what I liked about her.

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    Am I the only one who utterly hated Donna Noble? To the point where I missed most of Season 5 because of her, in fact. For me, she's the worst Companion in the show's history.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliot Kane View Post
    Am I the only one who utterly hated Donna Noble? To the point where I missed most of Season 5 because of her, in fact. For me, she's the worst Companion in the show's history.
    Season 4. And that must be why you hate her! I didn't like her either (in fact, I felt she was the worst NuWho companion). Then, I saw the entire season and I fell in love with her.
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    Oops! You're right! Five is Smith's first season, isn't it? And arguably the best season in all of New Who, taken as a whole. Yeah, glad I didn't miss that one!

    As for being in love with Donna, I think there is a far greater chance of me voluntarily bathing in acid She's just a horrible, horrible character.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliot Kane View Post
    Oops! You're right! Five is Smith's first season, isn't it? And arguably the best season in all of New Who, taken as a whole. Yeah, glad I didn't miss that one!

    As for being in love with Donna, I think there is a far greater chance of me voluntarily bathing in acid She's just a horrible, horrible character.
    My favorite Season overall might actually be Season 4, especially if you count Tennant's four specials as part of Season 4.

    Ny favorite Season with Smith is actually Season 7.



    You really hate Donna!!!

    You should watch this. WATCH THE WHOLE THING!!!

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    I truly hate Donna! Out of all of S4, I saw only Moffat's episodes, The Doctor's Daughter, which sounded awesome, and the finale. I do not expect that to change.

    I can understand loving S7. I think I fell madly in love with Oswin in about five minutes!

    The saddest thing about Clara - whatever incarnation she is in - is that only Moffat really seems to write her well. Everyone else is writing 'Amy-lite', so that she often seems to be two different people.

    The girl who out-thought Madame Vastra and kept her own mind after been 'Daleked' is more than a bit special. I like her written that way. The 'genius next door', if you will
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliot Kane View Post
    I truly hate Donna! Out of all of S4, I saw only Moffat's episodes, The Doctor's Daughter, which sounded awesome, and the finale. I do not expect that to change.

    I can understand loving S7. I think I fell madly in love with Oswin in about five minutes!

    The saddest thing about Clara - whatever incarnation she is in - is that only Moffat really seems to write her well. Everyone else is writing 'Amy-lite', so that she often seems to be two different people.

    The girl who out-thought Madame Vastra and kept her own mind after been 'Daleked' is more than a bit special. I like her written that way. The 'genius next door', if you will
    I agree with what you say about Clara, and I personally think Russell T Davies writes Doctor Who much better than Moffat. But that's just my opinion.
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    Russell T writes very differently to Moffat. I think that much we can all agree on!

    I prefer Moffat, but that one really is a matter of taste. Russell T is the master of high drama, Moffat of intricate plotting. Neither always pulls what they try off, of course, but who does?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliot Kane View Post
    Russell T writes very differently to Moffat. I think that much we can all agree on!

    I prefer Moffat, but that one really is a matter of taste. Russell T is the master of high drama, Moffat of intricate plotting. Neither always pulls what they try off, of course, but who does?
    Agreed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliot Kane View Post
    As for being in love with Donna, I think there is a far greater chance of me voluntarily bathing in acid She's just a horrible, horrible character.
    I must admit that Donna was not a favourite but, over time, I got used to her - not like the character, Mel Bush, who was companion of later Colin Baker and early Sylvester McCoy Doctors.



    Her squeaky, bossy, tantrummy companion nauseated me intensely and, I think, had it gone on longer, may have tempted me into that bath of acid.

    Oddly, I saw her in something more recently and she has mellowed into a pretty good actress now - though I couldn't stand her in Doctor Who. Donna is truly angelic in comparison.

    Though my favourite companion was Leela, who travelled for a few years with Tom Bakers Doctor.



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    Mel was my least favourite Companion until Donna came along. But I only really hated Mel a lot. Ideally, I'd put them in a room together and let them drive each other completely mad

    My favourite Companion is Romana II, who was smart, elegant and extremely ladylike. And better educated than The Doctor, leading to some great moments

    Jo Grant is my second favourite, as she's ditzy-adorable rather than ditzy-annoying, plus she's brave, loyal and charming. Most of the female Companions are good looking, but few can charm like Jo did.

    With that said, Clara Oswald has a definite shot at the title, if she starts getting written consistently. At the moment it seems that Moffat is the only one who truly gets the character, and as written by him she is unquestionably my favourite Companion. Unfortunately, that lack of consistency drags her down. She's brilliant, brave, caring and incredibly perceptive. And cute as a button, which doesn't hurt

    EDIT: Best LOOKING Companion is a whole other thing. There's some quite fierce competition for that one. Wendy Padbury (Zoe) was pretty gorgeous, and I was very partial to Sarah Sutton (Nyssa) in my younger days. Overall, I'd probably have to give it to Karen Gillan (Amy Pond) though. Today, at least. Tomorrow it might be different

    'Most girl next door' goes to Jenna Coleman (Clara Oswald), though. Especially with her hair up. She has such a beautiful face.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliot Kane View Post
    Best LOOKING Companion is a whole other thing. There's some quite fierce competition for that one. Wendy Padbury (Zoe) was pretty gorgeous, and I was very partial to Sarah Sutton (Nyssa) in my younger days. Overall, I'd probably have to give it to Karen Gillan (Amy Pond) though. Today, at least. Tomorrow it might be different

    'Most girl next door' goes to Jenna Coleman (Clara Oswald), though. Especially with her hair up. She has such a beautiful face.
    Best looking for me would have to be Jenna Coleman. She's gorgeous. Thank God she's not just a pretty face, however.
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    Very good actress as well, yes. I keep hoping they'll do a double Clara episode, so she can really stretch herself by playing two versions of the same character.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliot Kane View Post
    Very good actress as well, yes. I keep hoping they'll do a double Clara episode, so she can really stretch herself by playing two versions of the same character.
    Ooh like Oswin meets Clara or something like that?
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    I freaking love Doctor Who Started watching it a couple of months ago, the "NuWHo" and loved it The 10th Doctor is my favourite "You going my way, doll?" And favourite companions go as follows:

    1. Rose
    2. Donna
    3. Amy
    4. Martha
    5. Clara

    Wish they had a new companion for Capaldi, can't wait for Oswald to go, I don't hate her but I don't find her interesting enough

    Can anybody explain to me what the fuss is all about, people complaining about Moffat's writing on the Internet? I noticed some people say DW isn't DW anymore and I don't understand why xD
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    Quote Originally Posted by d1n0_xD View Post
    I freaking love Doctor Who Started watching it a couple of months ago, the "NuWHo" and loved it The 10th Doctor is my favourite "You going my way, doll?" And favourite companions go as follows:

    1. Rose
    2. Donna
    3. Amy
    4. Martha
    5. Clara

    Wish they had a new companion for Capaldi, can't wait for Oswald to go, I don't hate her but I don't find her interesting enough

    Can anybody explain to me what the fuss is all about, people complaining about Moffat's writing on the Internet? I noticed some people say DW isn't DW anymore and I don't understand why xD
    What don't you like about Clara?

    And some people say that he is sexist, due to the fact that most women he writes (at least in DW) are "damsels in distress".

    I disagree with this, although I do feel that his writing on Sherlock is MUCH better than his writing on DW. I feel that he can only write one female character on the show, although with Clara, he is getting better. River and Amy are written very similarly. He also makes DW stories very convoluted, but some people like that (me included).
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    ^ I don't know, I just don't find her funny or interesting as other companions... I just can't connect to her and I don't know why. The apparent 11th Doctor's fascination with her annoyed me even more because I couldn't see what he see in this "souffle girl" xD I mean, I know he explains it, it just doesn't capture me at all xD Her "leaf" story was puke-inducing to me, and I don't know why, and I know if that story was told by Amy for example I would've loved it xD I just don't like her that much and I will be glad when she's gone xD

    Oh, that's weird, I though the female characters were pretty bad-ass... And even if there was a damsel-in-distress, there's no harm in variety, some women are damsels in distress and that's okay, nothing bad there. But River and Rose (especially when she comes back for Doctor) are pretty badass, Amy has an amazing, funny personality, and I would say Rory is a damsel, but he also has his moments

    Some people say that the stories are complicated and I'm like "you didn't get the story, so you don't like it? Damn" xD The whole River and Doctor love thing was pretty cool in my book, how they kept meeting in points of time where River knows him more, and Doctors knows her less, and makes that River/10th Doctor moment in that library that much better

    Although he [Steven Moffat] did make himself a fool when he said that there's no evidence that the Doctor isn't human, when the Doctor clearly says he isn't human xD He was trying to make a point about the Doctor's humanity, and made himself a fool
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    Quote Originally Posted by d1n0_xD View Post
    ^ I don't know, I just don't find her funny or interesting as other companions... I just can't connect to her and I don't know why. The apparent 11th Doctor's fascination with her annoyed me even more because I couldn't see what he see in this "souffle girl" xD I mean, I know he explains it, it just doesn't capture me at all xD Her "leaf" story was puke-inducing to me, and I don't know why, and I know if that story was told by Amy for example I would've loved it xD I just don't like her that much and I will be glad when she's gone xD

    Oh, that's weird, I though the female characters were pretty bad-ass... And even if there was a damsel-in-distress, there's no harm in variety, some women are damsels in distress and that's okay, nothing bad there. But River and Rose (especially when she comes back for Doctor) are pretty badass, Amy has an amazing, funny personality, and I would say Rory is a damsel, but he also has his moments

    Some people say that the stories are complicated and I'm like "you didn't get the story, so you don't like it? Damn" xD The whole River and Doctor love thing was pretty cool in my book, how they kept meeting in points of time where River knows him more, and Doctors knows her less, and makes that River/10th Doctor moment in that library that much better

    Although he [Steven Moffat] did make himself a fool when he said that there's no evidence that the Doctor isn't human, when the Doctor clearly says he isn't human xD He was trying to make a point about the Doctor's humanity, and made himself a fool
    Looks like you have a serious case of Clara hate.

    Also, I agree, many people don't like the plotlines if they can't understand it.
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  23. #23

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    Zoo,

    I would love Oswin to meet Clara. Sadly, it seems unlikely. But given how many Claras there are, she's almost certain to meet herself at some point. I hope so, at least. What a waste if they don't!

    ***

    Dino,

    As near as I can tell, the main reason some people hate Moffat is because they have to actually pay attention to the story sometimes. Don't ask me why that's a bad thing, because I couldn't even begin to tell you.

    ***

    The first time I heard someone say that Moffat is a sexist who writes dreadful female characters, I laughed because I honestly thought they were joking. Far from being damsels in distress, his female characters tend to be anything but.

    Amy actively adds to the story by having strengths The Doctor lacks, which enables her to save the day sometimes when he can't.

    Clara is a genius who tends to outsmart everyone she comes across, whatever her incarnation, and managed to defeat the Great Intelligence throughout history at multiple points every single time. Not to mention talking three Doctors out of destroying Gallifrey, thereby saving the lives of billions.

    River Song is, basically, Lara Croft. Smart, tough archaeologist who is utterly lethal when she wants to be.

    Then there's Madame Vastra (Genius) and Jenny Flint (Ninja!).

    My honest impression is that anyone who thinks Moffat writes bad female characters or hates women has never actually watched Doctor Who.
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    @The Zoo Boy, yep, seems so


    Quote Originally Posted by Elliot Kane View Post
    Dino,

    As near as I can tell, the main reason some people hate Moffat is because they have to actually pay attention to the story sometimes. Don't ask me why that's a bad thing, because I couldn't even begin to tell you.

    Yeah, I don't understand that. What are they watching it for? For example, my girlfriend was kinda confused by the aforementioned Doctor/River love thing, but she still found it fascinating and praised Moffat for his writing. And then I explained it to her and the was blown away xD She's excited every time it says that Moffat wrote the episode in the intro xD


    Quote Originally Posted by Elliot Kane View Post
    The first time I heard someone say that Moffat is a sexist who writes dreadful female characters, I laughed because I honestly thought they were joking. Far from being damsels in distress, his female characters tend to be anything but.

    Amy actively adds to the story by having strengths The Doctor lacks, which enables her to save the day sometimes when he can't.

    Clara is a genius who tends to outsmart everyone she comes across, whatever her incarnation, and managed to defeat the Great Intelligence throughout history at multiple points every single time. Not to mention talking three Doctors out of destroying Gallifrey, thereby saving the lives of billions.

    River Song is, basically, Lara Croft. Smart, tough archaeologist who is utterly lethal when she wants to be.

    Then there's Madame Vastra (Genius) and Jenny Flint (Ninja!).

    My honest impression is that anyone who thinks Moffat writes bad female characters or hates women has never actually watched Doctor Who.
    Agreed. I think we live in an era where everything's offensive, and with the Internet, the very small group becomes quite vocal... But what baffles me is that they provide no evidence, and the fact that they are blind to stuff, it's like they're selective It's weird. But I agree, DW has some of the best female characters. Even while I don't like Clara, I can see that she is a genius
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    Quote Originally Posted by d1n0_xD View Post

    Yeah, I don't understand that. What are they watching it for? For example, my girlfriend was kinda confused by the aforementioned Doctor/River love thing, but she still found it fascinating and praised Moffat for his writing. And then I explained it to her and the was blown away xD She's excited every time it says that Moffat wrote the episode in the intro xD
    I am, too He's the best writer on the program right now, IMO. Most of my favourite eps of the New Who era are by him.

    Agreed. I think we live in an era where everything's offensive, and with the Internet, the very small group becomes quite vocal... But what baffles me is that they provide no evidence, and the fact that they are blind to stuff, it's like they're selective It's weird. But I agree, DW has some of the best female characters. Even while I don't like Clara, I can see that she is a genius
    Problem with Clara is that right now she's two different characters: as written by Moffat and as written by everyone else. If you only watch the Moffat stories, she's a fantastic character, but in the rest she's 'Amy-lite' - an inferior copy of a better original.

    Hopefully the new season will iron out the differences.

    As written by Moffat, she's my all time favourite Companion: smart, brave, resourceful, caring, feminine and flat out adorable. I even love her boho chic outfits. If Moffat had set out to write my ideal woman, he could hardly have done a better job. As written by everyone else, she's mid-tier at best, and often not even that.
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