|
|
#76
03-15-2012, 05:17 PM
|
|||
|
|||
Game: Thief 2 - The Metal Age
OM: Mission 10 - Life of the Party Ghost - Success  Perfect Thief - Chemical Success Supreme Ghost - Failed Perfect Supreme - Failed Time - 18:55:22  Loot - [Ghost: 2823] [Perfect Thief: 2853] [Supreme: 2448] Pockets Picked - 24/25 Locks Picked - 11 Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 0 Damage dealt - 0, Damage taken - 0 Healing taken - 0, Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 0 Secrets - 7/7 Consumables - 1 Invisibility Potion All listed stats are from the Perfect Thief run. See the entire report with screenshots here (top menu). Loot list here. Areas marked in blue only concern non-loot, non-objective related items. Comments: Hands down the best mission in the game. With the latest update of Tafferpatcher installed and ready to go, this would be an experience unlike most. I had already played and ghosted the alpha version ‘An Unwelcome Guest’, but this was the real deal. I don’t want ruin this description with lengthy chatter, so let’s get right to business. There can’t be many better objectives than ‘stay off the streets’. Instead I was to get to Angelwatch by way of the rooftops. Once there, I had to spy on Karras to find his reason for throwing the party and read his latest entry into the New Scripture of the Master Builder. In addition, I needed information on his Cetus project. 1,550 was my loot requirement, and I had to return to my starting position once everything else was done. The bank and armory objectives were gone from the demo mission, though both locations were still present (in modified fashion). I knew the mission was non-Supremable. There were three separate areas where the rules had to be broken for that mode. I would still try to keep first alerts and consumables to an absolute minimum, absent if possible. A conventional Perfect Thief had also been reported as impossible, though I would certainly try my best to attain it. Regular Ghost was similarly in for a tough time, though knowing it was possible gave me the confidence I needed to persist. Perhaps you can already tell, but I was really looking forward to this one! Rooftops Found some hidden coins in a window just south of the bell tower. Further west was a keeper overlooking some sort of mechanical plaza (see image). He didn’t alert to anything and even disappeared when I got too close to the window. Once he got displaced to the outside ledge, staring and stretching his day away. I wasn’t able to repeat this behavior, so I assume he’s supposed to just vanish. The archer here turned away from the window occasionally, making me able to sneak in. He always pivoted north, so I could easily wait for him to his south and grab the coin stack from the footlocker. Left using the same method. The only way to get all four pickpocket counts in the archer fight was to steal them during their quarrel. I picked the Willey archers first and waited for the fight to finish. Luckily, both Van Vernon archers survived and I could steal their pockets after they settled (see image below). Normally, I don’t like exploiting an ongoing conversation to steal something. To me, it busts Supreme if the participants would have alerted before or after. Of course, Supreme doesn’t allow unnecessary pickups, so these arrows were skipped for that mode. I just like including how to get all the items within the various set of rules. Had this been loot, I probably would have skipped it also. Snuck my way west after that.  Fieldstone was easy enough; only a little fiddling with the inside guard. Dropped the lifted key back to the walkway for Supreme. East of here was a thief’s hideout with some loot. The window was already broken, unlike the equivalent house in the demo mission. The flares in the innermost room couldn’t be taken without spawning a few first alerts from said thief. He commented on opening the door for one. Alerts like these are special, because it takes a long time to receive a settling remark, such as: “Eh, it’s just nothing.” Sometimes it can take up to several minutes. These special alert situations only arise when enemies comment from 1) opening a door, 2) closing a door, or 3) picking the lock of a door. Before settling, the enemy refuses to give additional comments, giving players the illusion no more first alerts are spawned. I always wait for the settling remark before moving on, so that I can count the total number of alerts and make my report more accurate. In total, the thief gave 5 alerts, 4 from opening and closing both doors and 1 from rushing past the fire from behind the pillar. The room below the cracked roof had a ring hidden in the corner. The housebreakers’ room was skipped for Supreme. Again, taking the loot during their conversation to me isn’t allowed, and the outside thief normally gave a first alert when rushing through the doorway anyway. I did not let the guard see them, as this would’ve caused a brawl and bust all modes. Plain Ghost was fine to take the loot. The necromancer’s had a secret hidden in the top floor fire (see image). It revealed a basement torture chamber with an invisibility potion I brought along for regular Ghost (see image below). Made sure to replace the elevators and close both secret panels.  Cleaned Shemenov’s roof without trouble. Have read other players with trouble here, but I came out of it without a single first alert. There was only one piece of loot, in the guards quarters below the archer’s lookout. The area surrounding the chimney was dark and nice for waiting out the patroller. The archer turned and didn’t see me descend into the kitchen. Managed after a few hops to leave the ladder unscathed and undetected. The female servant was jumpy, but nothing a creep-crouch-walk couldn’t handle. I exited and emerged to the southeast of the bank’s balcony. This was the only way to Angelwatch, as the alternate path from the demo mission was removed. I decided to wait with the bank until later. Had to utilize the opposite balcony and hug the walls to the east to avert comments. I could drop and mantle the various ledges unnoticed by either archer (see image below). Found the keeper’s weapons cache just outside Lady Louisa’s.  Inside Louisa’s came my first Supreme bust. This was an absolute killer, since the lady in red was staring straight for my only exit. I could steal her purse from the shadows undetected (see image), but moving further north was impossible. Both light sources were electrical lamps also. I thought perhaps I could cross the roof and bypass this window altogether, but alas I found no such possibility. Allowed as a last resort in plain Ghost, an engine exploit had to be employed. Both ladies had to be nudged away from view of the window in order to leave. I pushed the first one in behind the western pillar. Crouch-walking against her right side skidded her over in no time. The other took longer, but responded to the same maneuver. Neither lady did much commenting; rather, if alerted, they usually went straight to third level alarm mode. I tried pushing the red-dressed woman to the northeast corner first, but she caught me with a second alert trying to depart. Instead I slid her the other way, past the dresser by the large potted plant (see image below). I placed her away from direct contact with either object; hopefully this would decrease the risk of her commissioning the infamous turn-around bug upon returning. Now I could mantle the windowsill and leave without as much as a first alert.  Angelwatch For some reason I had the inclination to entirely avoid the elevator. I just felt it contradicted the “spirit” of Supreme too much. It doesn’t go against any rule, but it was just too noisy to justify operating. Plus, there were plenty of ways around it. From the outside hatch I could access every floor bar one and six. I started on two and would work my way up. The chapel was the only troublesome spot on this floor, as I needed the key from the priest to unlock the metal doors nearby (see image). They were both pickable, but needed to be relocked due to Supreme rule #7. The mentioned rule also states: “If items are picked off a patrolling AI, drop them back on the original patrol route or at their feet if they are a stationary AI.” Unfortunately, the key couldn’t be replaced without alerts. At his feet was metal, alerting everyone in the area. Even if you consider the surrounding stone to be at his feet, the priest went into hunt mode. Tried muffling the drop using a potion also, but to no avail. I thus skipped that loot for Supreme. The third floor contained very little of interest. I decided to access the library recording from below using a vine arrow into the wooden railing (see image below). That way I could mantle into the southeast corner without as much as a peep from the upstairs guests. They didn’t seem to mind a phonograph starting by itself either.  To the east on the same floor came another Supreme skip. A lady in a bedroom guarded a chest in the far corner (see image). The room was well-lit with only one entry point. I could rush in and to the left with only a mumble, but that busts Supreme. Picking the chest gave another comment, and a third one sprinting out. The fourth floor had more loot. Most of it was easy, except for a purse on a nobleman, Christopher, involved in a conversation. The chat only triggered in a certain part of the hallway, so I looted the rest of the floor first. He was talking to a lady who eventually left the room, while he remained stationed inside. There were three entry doors, but only the northern one left me hidden. Problem was, he gave a comment when opening or closing the door, thus busting Supreme. A trick to circumvent such situations is to exploit patrollers utilizing the same door. As the woman left I could let her open it, then frob the door as it swung shut, preventing it from closing. Only half the job was done though. I had to reclose the door as well after grabbing his purse. Plenty of guards and guests patrolled multiple floors and I had a feeling someone would come along for the taking. After a bit of surveying I discovered a lady in the red dress occasionally passes this room coming from the six floor. I waited in the shadows to the east, leaned around the corner and closed the door a second or so before she arrived (see image below). If timed correctly, the door would start to swing shut, then the woman would push it open again before it could make any noise. Lastly, she would close it on her own as she continued her patrol. I just love this little ploy!  The sixth floor ballroom was next. I kept the lights on and managed to avoid any and all alerts from the guests. The purse in the west was just a matter of moving along the wall, sneak slowly around the furniture piece and lean in for the loot. Used the walk-key all the way; the smallest tap on the run key and they commented. Same thing back to the entry door. From here I tackled the fountain coins. I could enter in the southeast corner, out of sight of all four enemies. The centerpiece conveniently blocked their views. Again creep-crouch-walking, hugging the base of the core, I could just reach all three pieces of loot without comments. The last was the trickiest (see image below). I found the sweet spot by inching forward, then leaning, quicksaving as needed. The man in the distance occasionally commented when doing regular stretches, that’s how close it was. Quite frankly, I was surprised the mech guard kept quiet. Finally I crept along the eastern wall to the recording. I could also sneak a little further north and trigger Vilnia’s chat unseen. Returned to the door and stole her key as she passed.  On to the fifth floor then. Nothing much to report until Karras’ office. Had to sneak very slowly through the living room to avoid comments from the nobleman there, but it was highly doable. Plenty of patrollers used passed through this area also, making the situation extra tense. Approached the office from the east. The southern wall, almost halfway down before the incropping, was a perfect shadow. I waited here for the patrolling mechanist to turn around and head back for the living room. I followed him and creep-crouch-strafed towards the door. The great thing about that method is it’s faster, but provides equal concealment to creep-crouch-walking. The only drawback is that you can’t see the direction you’re moving. Anyway, unlocking the door didn’t spawn a comment, which surprised me a tad. I blocked the easternmost door as the other opened. The procedure here was exactly the same as in ‘An Unwelcome Guest’, where I had to nudge the guard forward enough to squeeze by. It was a tight timeline with the patroller returning, but after a few tries it was done (see image). I left the door open and grabbed the schematics through the painting (see image below). There was a tiny opening towards the bottom, while crouching, that enabled me to grab the objective without triggering the alarm or disabling the security system. This is the same as frobbing items or levers without slashing banners and has been deemed acceptable. It is not transmigration, which would be an engine exploit, disallowed even in regular Ghost for this scenario (as there are other options). My first Supreme alert came when relocking the door. This spawned a comment from the outside guard. That mode was already gone due to several instances of nudging, but I would’ve loved to get through the mission without any conventional alerts. Alas, that wasn’t to be.  I snuck east and cleared both mechanists. Entered the kitchen by using the servant’s patrol route. Frobbed the door as he left and went in without comments from the sentry. Watched out for the circling lady in red also; she was on the move constantly. I cleared the rest of this floor easily, save the office in the southwest. Both bedrooms in the west spawned comments when opening the doors. The purse off the nobleman here was thus skipped for Supreme, as was the Carlysle armory key. The Golden Boy The upcoming endeavors I take no credit for whatsoever. I direct all honor and glory to Sneak, for his incredible persistence, determination and patience in straight Ghosting the golden child in the southwest office. Old Man has done it too in the past, although I don’t know of anyone else. As you probably realize, an invisibility potion is the easy way out, leaving the stats with a less honorable ‘Chemical Success’. But I knew he was possible to Ghost without consumables, so I was going to do it, come what may. I started by bringing the following items into the back office by the safe: 1 mechanist mace from the adjacent bedroom, 3 boxes from the kitchen storage room, 2 more boxes from the second floor guards quarters, plus whatever potions and scrolls I had on hand. There were plenty more equipment available, but at least that was a start. The metal chute in the kitchen was very helpful in bringing anything up from the lower floors. I had read Sneak’s report from the old archives a few times. His descriptions were very detailed, but sadly the image links were broken. The golden boy fidgets a lot, and that was the trick to nailing him. He has a strange maneuver where he extends his left arm, as if pointing and towards the end of that move he slides a tiny bit forward. That movement is repeated fairly frequently, enough to traverse the room in a manageable timeframe (if you call 10 hours ‘manageable’). He slides forward and slightly to the right. He grinds against the western wall for most of his voyage, coming in contact with the windows here. At the end of each window he eventually gets stuck, as the windowsill causes an indentation preventing forward movement. The challenge was how to get him to fidget past the first two windows. Another clue was that he traverses faster when stuck in boxes. I started by placing boxes in front of where he spawned, but this only made him stop as he reached the first one. Instead I dropped boxes so that he spawned inside the first (image 1 below). I used five boxes total, lining them up until just past the first window. They had to be exactly parallel to each other, nearly flush with the wall, but not entirely. I focused on placing the first parallel to the wall a few inches out; the following ones I then dropped at the same angle as the first and used Garrett to push the boxes into the right position. Once dropped, the boxes retain that angle permanently and pushing into them won’t change that, so this was an efficient method to use. They also have an invisible clipping border outside the visible edge, so it looks like they’re an inch or so apart but in reality they are not. The left image below shows Goldie’s starting position and how the boxes are aligned. I bounced a scouting orb off the wall from around the corner by the safe. I could strafe into the corner here before the orb landed and the camera kicked in. With a little luck it landed away from the boxes and I could monitor him from safety. Image 2 below shows my successful attempt at getting Goldie past the first window, only 70 minutes after reading the New Scripture of the Master Builder. He didn’t slide through the crates at an equal rate though. It seems like he hit a snag transitioning from one crate to the next, as he stood still for a while then suddenly went through into the next box. I had to readjust the boxes a few times before pinning it, but overall this part went surprisingly well. Notice how he has fallen off the boxes and has both feet planted on the ground. If this happened while on the boxes I had to start over, as he wouldn’t budge from that point on. I was very lucky with the second scouting orb toss. It landed right in the corner of the windowsill where he tends to get stuck. I didn’t know whether this in the end got him loose or if it was the boxes alone. Regardless, he was free to move on. 1  2  I guess I could’ve placed boxes all the way past the second window, but Sneak originally reported a much easier method. The mechanist mace from the adjacent bedroom apparently served as a “perfect tool” for the job. Alas, it didn’t work for me the first time around. I suspected I had put it backwards, with the handle facing the golden boy. Sure enough he clipped the windowsill corner and wouldn’t budge. I would have to start over. I suspected a simple mace switcharound would do the job, but this time the boy wouldn’t even pass the first window. I had a difficult time reconstructing the scenario from the images above. The boxes were in exactly the same position, but for some reason he still got stuck. I kept fiddling with the orb placement in the second window for a while, thinking that might need to be in a perfect slot, but that didn’t help either. In the end I abandoned the idea of any items in the window and refocused my attention on the boxes. I adjusted the first box a little, but other than that they stayed the same. After 2-3 days of work on this, he finally passed like before. I can’t pinpoint the reason for the change in result, but I can assure you no items are needed for the first window besides 5 boxes. I don’t think the boy clips orbs or any other items of like bulkiness. I did find another strange occurrence though, messing around with the scouting orb. If Garrett is hidden out of view of the boy, the scouting orb will have to face him for the boy to make his sliding stretch-the-left-arm movement. Occasionally I would leave the computer on overnight only to come back in the morning and find the boy hadn’t moved an inch, then I would turn the camera to face him and boom he would slide through the first box in 5 minutes. Seems the dark engine shuts off idle movement simply by facing a different direction. This obviously helped me nail him in the end. From here, all I had to do was wait and see if my new mace placement was good enough. I left him a foot or so away from the crucial spot (see image 3 below). Waking up the sixth morning I finally found him past the safe. Oh sweet golden delight! 17:44:57 on the clock, he was now stuck in the third window, a few feet away from the southern wall (image 4 below). I think I did three hardsaves at the time, though I can’t be sure, as I was in a complete haze of accomplishment. Everything was a blur. I know I frantically started to nightmare of potential Windows blue screens, spontaneously corrupting savegames and sudden hard drive formatting viruses. Basically, anything that would constitute a momentary worst case scenario and force me to restart. 3  4  Subsequent endeavors sort of seemed like a Sunday picnic compared to the test just passed. But I went on my merry way regardless. Started by returning the mace and the three boxes from the kitchen storeroom. Dropped the office key back to the living room for Supreme. Vilnia had that room as part of her route. Opened the panel in the hallway closet just to get the secret count. It didn’t go against any rules, so why not? The statue secret had to be skipped though, as the open door made both patrollers in the area comment. They also made a small detour towards the door, but they never went into search mode. Dropped the red key back to this hallway for Supreme as I brought the last two boxes back to the second floor. I made sure to give the golden boy a last long look, as a thank you for our recent 15 hours together. The lowest floor held the building’s last two pieces of loot. Two statues guarded by a stationary mechanist and a patrolling robot by the main entrance. The door could be accessed from the outside but involved bashing the lock open. That is property damage and busts all modes. No known key is assigned to unlock it either. I also needed to break a crate to prevent taking damage in the fall from the tower’s northern ledge. That is also frowned upon and a less admirable way of beating the mission. The foyer moreover was brightly lit and no surfaces suitable for vine arrow attachment. The alcove in the image below is the closest I could get without first alerts from the guard. I could rush in and hide behind the couch armrest, but the robot alerted when heading back south. The couch doesn’t block their view even though it appears like it should. The only way to reach them was by means of an invisibility potion. I could run over and reach both items and get back to the shadow before the invisibility effect wore off, although it was a close call. Had to crouch behind the guard not to cause a comment. I actually finished the mission twice, once by skipping this loot and another by grabbing it, in order to eliminate the ‘chemical’ label for plain Ghost. It is up to each individual which is more preferable. Supremers obviously need to skip it. I might do a test run and leave my old computer on for a weekend and see if the guard fidgets in any significant direction, but I doubt any result will come of it.  Back In the Streets I returned to Lady Louisa’s house and found the girls in the spots I left them. Seems like they didn’t mind their relocations too much. The bank was up next. Crossed the street by way of the east balcony again. This way was tougher than before and I had to tap my walk key to drop from the ledges alert-free. Entering the bank from this side involved exploiting the patrollers usage of the double doors. The stationary archer here commented if I as much as touched them. As he appeared I snuck in behind his back. Creep-crouch-walking was the only way I could enter the offices without the archer across the street commenting. I waited for the patroller again and closed the door in his face. That way he would bounce it open and the archer didn’t alert when he closed it. For some reason, enemies know who makes noise despite not actually seeing it. Anyway, I was in the clear and could rob the safe in peace. The key from his belt wasn’t necessary as the main office door was pickable and another copy of the key was on the counter inside. Lock-blocked the door so I could replace the key for Supreme afterwards. Just west of the bank came another Supreme skip. The apartment here was guarded by a swordsman. He had to be nudged forward a few feet in order to access the door leading to the loot (see image above). The alternate way was breaking the glass ceiling, but that alerted everyone and is an obvious bust. 75 more loot skipped, bringing the total to 405 gold missed for that mode.  If going for the armory, the stash in there was no problem to obtain. The most troublesome thing was retrieving the vine arrow from outside the window without getting damaged in the fall. The greenhouse also spawned a first alert when opening the door. If this is not a problem for you, the arrows in here can be taken without further alerts. I could easily inch my way along the left counter and lean in for the grab. The rest of the way home was completely trouble-free. Notes & Busts - To get credit for the pickpockets during the archer fight, they had to be stolen during their argument. It’s a matter of opinion whether this is allowed or not. - Skipped the loot in the room with the housebreakers for Supreme. Entering spawned a first alert comment from the outside thief. I don’t allow using their conversation as a means of taking the loot for that mode. - Taking the flares in the hideout east of Fieldstone spawned first alerts from the thief inside. Not allowed under Supreme Ghost rules. - Had to nudge both women at Lady Louisa’s house to safely exit through the window. This is an engine exploit and not allowed for Supreme. It is, however, allowed as a last resort in regular Ghost, so that mode was still in the clear. - Skipped two golden goblets and a scouting orb on the second floor of Angelwatch for Supreme. The required key couldn’t be dropped back by the priest’s feet without alerts. - Another Supreme skip was a coin stack in a bedroom on the third floor. The lady commented on passing the doorway and picking the chest. - Had to nudge the guard by Karras’ office forward about a foot or so in order to enter the room. This is a Supreme bust but allowed in plain Ghost. I also spawned a first alert comment from the same guard when relocking the door and leaving. - Skipped a purse off a nobleman in the west on the fifth floor for Supreme. He alerted when opening the door. - The Carlysle armory key (and consequently the items in the armory itself) could not be taken without triggering a first alert comment from the sleeping guest. If playing by Supreme rules, those items thus have to be skipped. - Had to stack boxes and a mace by the wall and wait for “Goldie” to fidget his way past the first two windows. Stacking boxes on an enemy’s patrol route and engine exploits are busts to Supreme. - Couldn’t obtain the items in the secret weapons cache in the fifth floor hallway without triggering alerts from the two passing patrollers. - Needed to use an invisibility potion to obtain the two statues in the first floor foyer. Can easily be skipped for plain Ghost. Renders the Perfect Thief run a ‘chemical success’. - Had to nudge a guard in order to reach the three coin stacks in the apartment north of Sir Cullen’s Keep. Last resort for plain Ghost, skipped for Supreme. - The arrows in the greenhouse could not be taken without alerting the spider. He gave a chirp as the door opened. Needs to be skipped if playing by Supreme rules.
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports Last edited by Klatremus; 03-17-2012 at 06:06 AM. Reason: Forgot to list consumables in the stats 
|
|
#77
03-15-2012, 05:53 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
You are, as always, the boss. I wish I could think of 1000 ways to say "well done" to give you the props you deserve, but a simple "well done" will have to do.
Well done. Precious Cargo is fun, but is pretty easy (although I'm interested to see if you can find a better way to handle Captain Markham). Then you have Kidnap, a royal pain in the arse. You are the King of all things Ghosting. I shall operate my dukedom in YouTube and send all appropriate gifts and taxes your way.
__________________
A true professional doesn't leave a mess. My YouTube channel-Thief Ghosting videos!
|
|
#78
03-19-2012, 11:49 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Life of the Party *update*
I left my work computer on over the weekend to see if the mech guard at the main entrance would move, and he sure did. He slid left and ended up inside the couch nearest him. None of the couches clip except the lower half of their armrests. He finally got stuck by the wall in the southernmost armrest of that couch. This gave me hope to evade his gaze by quickly running to the left upon entry. This experiment was however utter failure. Going for the nearest left corner he always went to hunt mode. If aiming for the wall directly to his west he went straight to alarm. I tried mossing the floor and even applying a speed potion. I know this is the same as the invisio potion, but I just wanted to test if it was possible. I figured if it isn't possible with the extra momentum boost of a speed potion, then it isn't even worth trying without it. And that's exactly what I found. I didn't manage to pass him with or without a potion.
My initial conclusion remains: In order to get the two statues, you need to apply fluid of disappearance. If it hadn't been furnished with couches however, this room would've been Ghostable (and the mission Perfect Thievable).
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports Last edited by Klatremus; 03-25-2012 at 12:31 AM.
|
|
#79
03-24-2012, 06:17 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Mods, sorry if this isn't appropriate for this thread
Klatremus, I like your site although I can't read much of it yet (walkthroughs)! Tarvis, your videos have inspired me to dust off Thief that I haven't seriously played for years and start to re-learn how to play these games within the Ghosting rules. I wasn't much of a forumite when the games came out and didn't quite restrict myself as heavily as those rules but I think I can have a decent shot on at least the basic Ghosting for most of the levels. I'm planning on starting with Thief 2 as I preferred that game overall. Hopefully I'll have an update soon with my first Ghosted mission. Again, thanks for inspiring me to pick up these games again.
|
|
#80
03-25-2012, 12:30 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
You have my best wishes for your Thief 2 Ghost run, Itko!
The Ghosting rules will liberate you in ways you'd never imagine. Of course, I understand the indimidation of Supreme Ghost, but giving it a shot couldn't hurt.  Tarvis79's videos are fantastic. And his narration makes it highly entertaining also. Glad you like my reports and my site. 
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports
|
|
#81
03-25-2012, 05:11 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Game: Thief 2 - The Metal Age
OM: Mission 1 - Running Interference Perfect Thief - Success Supreme Ghost - Failed (see below) Perfect Supreme - As above Time - 0:48:20 Loot - [Perfect Thief: 1285] Pockets Picked - 9/10 Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 8 (objective) Damage dealt - 8, Damage taken - 0 Healing taken - 0, Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 0 Secrets - 3/3 Consumables - None Summary I had practised on this mission a few times so even though my aim is to simply Ghost (or Perfect Thief) the missions I went for as close to Supreme as I could get without messing around with box stacks. I have done the "stack boxes to mantle over front gate" thing before but it always seems a little ridiculous and I decided not to this time. In addition, I wanted max pickpockets and you can't really Supreme doing that. The main tricky bits are all outside with the worst being taking the loot in the middle of the courtyard. I like this as a first mission - just the right size to not be overwhelming and with a few tricky areas so it's still a challenge. Detail I'm going to do a mostly step by step but I'm going to be very brief on areas which are easy: After grabbing the Butler's key and heading upstairs the first tricky area is knocking out the guard with the short patrol at the top of the stairs. I had got to a reasonable mastery of this through earlier playthroughs but it still took three attempts to get it without alerting. I then quickly cleared the eastern wing (including upstairs) and headed through the Great Hall (or whatever it's called), grabbed the Weddings Rings and into the Kitchen for Knockout 2 (the servant). Cleared the kitchen (Secret 1 - but put the potion back) and used the dumb-waiter for the key and loot in the Dining Room. You can't really return that guy's key and that's the only Supreme fail for me in this one but as I said the box stacking just seems a bit excessive and I'm not really going for Supremes this time around. I also made a bit of noise jumping to get the coins above the stairs to the Great Hall but there's no one anywhere near so I didn't reload. Headed through the rest of the basement (to the west), knocking out the patrolling archer and grabbing loot from various rooms. Next, I went back upstairs to the western wing and took the patrolling guard's purse and cleared the music room before heading into the far west wing rooms. No problems here again, Secret 2 complete. I now went back outside (the long way) and opened the front gate to enter the courtyard. Up to this point the only loading I had done were the two on the first knockout guy but that wasn't to continue! I had to make a fair few attempts at getting the pickpockets from the patrolling archer right - not necessary for Supreme so I wouldn't have done it there but needed it to get max pickpockets (obviously). It's pretty tricky getting the "close enough to grab, not close enough to be seen" spot but eventually I found it. Move around the courtyard is pretty easy once you realise it doesn't matter that you're in "yellow" light all the time and you stick to the walls. Fairly easily reached the darkness to the right of the doorway (as you face it) and waited for the patrol to go past. Mantled up and hugged the wall around to the alcove to the right of the doors and again waited for the patrol. At this point I ended up doing a lot of saving and reloading due to the left-hand guard (still as you face the door) seeing me when I moved behind his buddy. I eventually got behind, saved and commenced the knockout. This took a little while as I wasn't quite close enough to grab the body a few times and a few other times he fell forward into the second guard's view. Once I managed it, I dropped the body in the darkness by the stairs and moved to the other side to fairly easily dispatch the second guard. The only tricky section here is actually passing the door as the frame sticks out and you have to really hug it to avoid the guard seeing you. I was now ready to take the loot in the centre and this was the most fiddly and time consuming section for me. I actually got up on the door "platform" and after a few reloads landed on the grass but even though I tried a fair number of times I couldn't quite get to the loot and back without being seen. It might have worked eventually but I decided my starting position wasn't good enough and retreated. This time I started from the alcove to the right of the door (previously I had been starting from the darkness by the left-hand stairs). I landed on the grass after maybe 5-6 attempts and I was definitely better set up for the grab. Still took at least 10 reloads to avoid the first alert from the patroller but I made it in and out. Dropped the keys back where the guards had been standing (I've been dropping keys on patrol routes throughout, just forgot to mention) and entered the house again. I went downstairs and cleared the other half of the basement including knocking out the two guards watching the torchlit corridor (this took one reload as the first time the female fell forward and even though I instantly knocked the male out he cried "NOOOOOOOO" as he fell). Knocked out the stationary guard on Basso's route and took Secret 3's loot (but nothing else). Headed back towards Basso to whistle and realised I hadn't locked the front gate (I had dropped the last gold key in the dining room entrance). Went back, got the key, locked the gate, whistled and put the key back while Basso "rescued" his future wife. I met the happy couple on the way back and once they were through I locked the Butler's room doors and dropped the key before finishing the mission. Not a hard one really and quite a small mission but definitely pleased with myself. Shipping...and Receiving might be a bit of a nightmare now though...
|
|
#82
03-25-2012, 06:46 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Itko, welcome! It's wonderful to see another Ghoster in our dedicated little community. What a pleasant surprise greeted my return from spring break!
Nice work on Running Interference! Shipping...and Receiving is much harder, but it's also one of the best missions in the series. Looking forward to reading everything!
__________________
A true professional doesn't leave a mess. My YouTube channel-Thief Ghosting videos!
|
|
#83
03-25-2012, 10:19 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Shipping...and Receiving is definitely tough! I've been playing around with the spiders on the ship for a while now with no real progress. If they don't see me they just beeline for the guard on the ship even if there are boxes in the way. Will have to have a rethink of those.
Also, the loot behind the banners is going to have to be left. I've seen mention of a technique for getting through but I'll save that for another attempt - this will be a straight Ghost (not Perfect).
|
|
#84
05-02-2012, 10:16 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Game: Thief 2 - The Metal Age
OM: Mission 11 - Precious Cargo Ghost - Success Perfect Thief - Success Supreme Ghost - Failed Perfect Supreme - Failed Time - 1:09:29 Loot - 1627/1627 Pockets Picked - 4/5 Locks Picked - 2 Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 0 Damage dealt - 0, Damage taken - 0 Healing taken - 0, Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 0 Secrets - 1/1 Consumables - None See the entire report with screenshots here. Loot list here. Areas marked in blue only concern non-loot, non-objective related items. Comments: A surprisingly good mission! It fits in well with the mechanist theme, which after all should dominate the story. I just don’t know if I like them as a faction. They seem like a modern version of the hammerites to me. And Thief really isn’t about being modern…but I digress. A few challenging points along the way, but other than that this was quite a nice ride. Well, my trip to Angelwatch wasn’t entirely in vain. I was to pick up our only lead, Cavador, from Markham Isle. To help me out, I was to get intel from our informant Lotus first. My side quests were to locate another Master Builder scripture, steal the lighthouse keeper’s antique navigation globe, and find Dark William Markham’s long lost treasure. I started with 3 vine arrows and 1 scouting orb; those could always come in handy for a Ghoster. Caves & Surface The only tough spot reaching the surface was at the top of Long Tom’s Wall (cool name by the way). I opened the workshop gate first, to get the loot in there. I could’ve utilized the surface well for that, but I decided to get it out of the way early. The guard for the control mechanism had his back turned and the watcher was easy to dodge. Most of the vines were dark also. Went down to flip the lever again afterwards. Snuck out by waiting in the dark corner for the moving arbalist (see image below). The other guard was stationary with two angles. If pivoting south, I could creep along the wall and exit through the open gate. The patroller came to a halt at the top of a long metal slope. I inched up the first portion and hid in the gravelly shadows to the west (see image).  Entered the house via the base of the lighthouse. Found a few hard-to-see coin pairs on the first floor (see image). Several patrollers alerted to broken windows and sometimes started hunting completely out of my control. Reloading usually fixed the problem. One of the guards involved in the conversation upstairs had a purse. I could enter during their chat and grab the purse without as much as a first alert, but I don’t like exploiting conversations like this. It just doesn’t feel right, so I waited. The other guard eventually left and kept patrolling the halls and the patio. There were two entry doors, but both spawned comments. Instead I flung a vine arrow into the outside wall and grabbed the purse through the window (see image below). If you see this as an engine exploit, go ahead and skip this purse for Supreme. Or exploit their conversation, your choice. Regular Ghosters can sneak into the room through the southern door whenever. Found the navigation globe in the hidden wallspace on this floor also.  Couldn’t return the cold storage key to the lighthouse for Supreme. The priest alerted and there were no soft surfaces within reasonable distance. I took the bust and kept the key. Underground Base, South Got new objectives to board the Cetus Amicus and read the captain’s log. Raised the elevator and closed the entrance gate before ducking under. Went for Markham’s treasure right away. Didn’t use either of the pressure doors. Just mantled up the cave ledge when the stationary mechanist faced the wall. Could just make the entire swim without surfacing for breath. The situation with the pirate haunt was well-known. He spawned upon taking the treasure and faced the doorway. Impossible to fool him in conventional fashion. I was prepared to repeat Sneak, Old Man and Peter Smith’s method of blocking his view with rubble pieces, but Tarvis79 reported and recorded an alternate (and much easier) method. A single rubble piece in the correct location turned him 90˚ to his right upon spawning (see image below). It had to be placed at the outer edge of the top step, slightly to the south. This made the exit a piece of cake. I blocked the right door open first, so I could emerge from the water on the left side unseen. Then all I had to do was creep-crouch-walk out the doors and to the right. Not even a gasp indicating a first alert. Closing the door also went unnoticed. Had to inch my way down the stairs carrying the rubble back to avoid attention, but I didn’t get any remarks. This was naturally an engine exploit, and busted Supreme again. It was inevitable and followed a mandatory objective.  Entered subaquatic post 1 through the diving hatch. Cleaned everything unbothered. Found a well-hidden purse in the flooded base (see image). The nugget on the rafter in the outside cave took one well-struck vine arrow from the northwest doorway. The patrolling guards were too far away to comment, plus there was more shade up top. To get back down I leapt onto the metal outcropping and grabbed my arrow. From here I could drop into the water in the far northwest. The only guy to worry about was the patroller in the metal hall underneath. He sometimes alerted in another room, outside my audio range, then he would suddenly come into range in full hunt mode. I waited several minutes and swam around a bit before I saved, to make sure I was completely clean. I even swam down to observe him through the window. The biggest challenge in the entire southern area was getting into the old living quarters unalerted. Karras’ scripture was in there, which was a mandatory objective. I tried with a rope arrow into the same rafter as the nugget, just further south, but there was always a guard commenting. Those stationary arbalists pivoted, but they could see me from both angles. Then you had the two patrollers also. I realized I had to approach the situation differently. I found the best way to ready myself was from the southwest corner of the pirate base. From the top of a vine arrow I could time the patrols and watch to make sure the sentries were facing away (first image below). I tried doing something similar from the inner staircase, but the distance to the cave was too great. When everything seemed suitable, I mantled and moved for the cave opening. Creep-crouch-strafe has become my new favorite way of movement. I have mentioned it in several reports and here it is again. It is the fastest way to move without altering the light gem. The only drawback being you can’t see in the direction you’re moving. That was an acceptable disadvantage. Both guards had to face north until I was halfway across the bridge. After that, they didn’t comment at said speed irrespective of facing angle. I timed the patroller below nicely also, as he was walking away at this point. The upper patroller was on his way back but I reached the darkness of the cave just in time. Going back I used a similar method, but I met the returning patroller too soon and needed to get off the bridge somehow. I found I could mantle the railing without alerts and from here I slid down silently. Notice how my light gem is bright red in the second picture below. This last move was tough, but highly rewarding to get out of Supreme-clean.   Underground Base, North Entered through the tunnel to the Cetus Amicus. Utilized the water underneath the walkways for easy travel. I could steal the equipment in subaquatic post 2 by taking advantage of the gap in the guard’s vision. The windows provided enough hard cover to fool him. It wasn’t too hard. Had to skip the two potions behind the nearby window though. Breaking the glass was the only option. The keys for cargo holds 1-4 was protected by a stationary arbalist in the same room (see image). He gave a comment when the door opened, so the keys (and thus the equipment inside the holds) weren’t accessible within Supreme rules. The main cargo hold had an objective (undisclosed as of yet) protected by another stationary mechanist. I could mantle up the northeast corner from the water (see image below). Unlocking the door didn’t cause any commotion, but closing it spawned a first alert. I also couldn’t return the key for obvious reasons. I contemplated dropping it at the bottom of the water under the walkway. That would’ve been a logical explanation for a lost key in such surroundings, but I held on to it. I had to climb the shack and plunge into the water in the back to avoid further alerts.  Not much to report from the submarine. A well-hidden piece of loot behind some crates in the middle floor closet. Received new objectives to get a sample of rust gas and find the cargo locker 5 key, both of which I had in my possession. Luckily, the objective didn’t remain checked if I dropped the key, so no need to return it to subaquatic post 1. Notes & Busts - Couldn’t return the cold storage key to the lighthouse for Supreme without alerting the priest. Supreme bust. - Had to utilize an engine glitch to fool Captain Markham’s ghost. Busts Supreme but allowed for plain Ghost as a last resort. - The keys for cargo lockers 1-4, and consequently all the equipment inside, couldn’t be taken within Supreme rules. Opening the door in the shanty spawned a comment from the stationary guard. - Had to skip the two potions in the glass cabinet in subaquatic post 2. Property damage is against all modes. - Closing the main cargo hold door spawned a comment from the outside guard. Also had to skip replacing the key, as this brought him to hunt mode. Supreme busts.
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports Last edited by Klatremus; 05-13-2012 at 01:32 PM.
|
|
#85
05-13-2012, 02:03 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Game: Thief 2 - The Metal Age
OM: Mission 12 - Kidnap Ghost - Success Perfect Thief - Success Supreme Ghost - Failed Perfect Supreme - Failed Time - 2:28:24 Loot - 2988/2988 [Supreme: 2768] Pockets Picked - 10/11 Locks Picked - 7 Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 1 Damage dealt - 1, Damage taken - 0 Healing taken - 0, Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 0 Secrets - 1/1 Consumables - 1 Water Arrow See the entire report with screenshots here. Loot list here. Areas marked in blue only concern non-loot, non-objective related items. Comments: Believe it or not, Kidnap is one of my favorite missions in the game. I rank it in the top 5, along with ‘Shipping…and Receiving’, ‘First City Bank and Trust’, ‘Life of the Party’ and ‘Sabotage at Soulforge’. It is very hard, especially if going for all the loot and gear, and even more so if Supreme Ghosting. But as I’ve alluded to before, many missions in Thief 2 are just too easy, which in my eyes make them boring. Kidnap also has one of the niftiest Ghost moves in history. I’m of course talking about Sneak’s ‘Unhooking the Caboose’. I can’t even imagine how much experimentation lies behind that endeavor. Situations like such make missions memorable, and that’s exactly what Kidnap is. Not much had changed objective-wise since the start of Precious Cargo. The instructions said to “find and kidnap Brother Cavador, and take him with you when you escape”. Kidnapping implies blackjacking, and I obviously couldn’t take him with me unless he was unconscious. The 1 damage was therefore excused, but no other busts could be incurred in the process. As of now, the only other important objective was to find a sample of Karras’ New Scripture. I am happy I read Sneak’s archived report of this mission before I started my Ghost run. I had failed to realize that Cavador’s trio doesn’t start patrolling until you read the papyrus revealing his route. I thought they started patrolling as you enter the K.D. site, or even at the start of the mission. The fact that you can control their patrol like this makes the entire mission a lot more attractive. I absolutely hate (with extreme and utter passion) timed video games. I enjoy doing things at my own pace, being as thorough as I can, until I feel comfortable moving on. If I would’ve had to find Cavador within a certain amount of time, this mission would have plunged to the bottom of my list. I know that wouldn’t have done the mission justice, but that simply reflects my revulsion of time requirements. I’ll take Yoshi’s Island over Super Mario World any day of the week. This also meant my way through the mission changed. I planned on clearing the sites first and then unhook Cavador towards the end. The main reason being the green lights that turn on at each site as the trio passes through. Not having to deal with those would make eliminating first alerts easier, or should I say less excruciating. Although I knew Supreme would be busted during the kidnapping (due to engine exploits), I was determined to reduce other busts (first alerts and consumables) to an absolute minimum. The main base was simple. Nothing to report there. I dropped the papyrus map back for Supreme right away. The site numbers remained on my map. Brought Cavador’s itinerary with me without reading it. Garrett gave a verbal acknowledgement if doing so, indicating the start of his patrol. As mentioned, I wanted to delay that until everything was ready. I couldn’t close the bay door leading to the K.D. site. My first Supreme bust. There should’ve been a lever to close it on the other side. Are guards entering just to leave it open like that? Seemed strange for a place with such tight security. And what about people needing to leave? Site 8 I always go for all the equipment in addition to loot. I don’t bring it with me due to the Supreme rules (unnecessary pickups are busts), but I like the added challenge seeing if it’s possible. My first such challenge came from the southeast building at Site 8. The gear was in the second, slanted building (a potion and two mines), protected by two guards and a camera (see image). There was a third guard in the room across the site, but he was irrelevant for now. I could drop straight down and run into the doorway timing only the patroller and the watcher. The female arbalist in the building underneath was out of my view. Her range was blocked by the window frames. Getting back to the roof was the real problem. The patroller walked a fair bit past the camera before he pivoted. If the watcher swung away during the last stretch of his patrol I could make a run for it. The woman easily made comments when stepping on the exit ramp. Both ramps had metal sides, so I had to stay off those. The timing had to be perfect, plus the mantle onto the roof had to be out of view of the woman inside the window (see image below). I did need to climb the ramp some, to even be close enough for the mantle. Tough move this, but I came clean without any alerts.  I moved along the rooftops and reached the building with the loot in the northeast corner. Unfortunately it had to be skipped for Supreme. Picking the lock to the chest alerted the stationary guard downstairs. There is no need to fiddle with those sorts of busts. You just take it and move along. Plain Ghost mode was in the clear to take the nugget, as it was only a first alert. The patroller could also alert from this, so I picked it when he was further away, just to eliminate the extra comment. Site 7 Entering Site 7 from the east involved dodging two watchers and a patroller. I could rush across the street and hide in the shadows along the wall. I inched up towards the lamp and found the sweet spot (see image). At the perfect moment, I could swing around the corner and into the dark house there. No chirps from either watcher in the process. I could reach the loot and the equipment from the south building in the main courtyard without any trouble. All it took was a hop through the broken wall. There was another piece of loot in the northeast building, a well-hidden stack of coins behind a bucket (see image). The last piece was an artifact on the outside table. I didn’t find any way to obtain this keeping Supreme intact, so I had to make another skip for that mode. The stationary mechanist by the ramp on the west side always gave a comment when I leaned in for the grab. I could wait for the gap in the watcher’s view like in the picture below, but as soon as I rounded the corner, he alerted. There was no shade around and no way to turn off the lights (which would’ve busted Supreme anyway).  I gave getting the gear inside the west control room a real shot. There was no real point in getting it, but it was fun trying. The guy inside had his back turned the entire time. The closest I got was hunt mode from the female by the outside control box. That was after mossing the ramp and doing a running jump from the south roof (see image). I avoided chirps from both watchers, and only received a comment from the ramp guard. The southwest corner beside the ramp was dark, but there was no way to reach it as the guard was too close to the wall. I even tried squeezing in there from directly above, but I bounced off his head into the courtyard. I figured I might have been able to wait out the first alerts from those shadows and then quickly mantle up the ramp and sprint inside before getting busted. I could have tried to wait him out to see if he idled/fidgeted away from the wall, but I decided not to bother. I managed to enter, grab the items and leave, only spawning a first alert from the ramp guard, but it required the use of an invisibility potion. So if you value the gear over the potion, go right ahead. Site 2 The only viable entry point was from the east. Plenty of patrollers in this area. Picked three purses here, at least. Read the master builder scripture and grabbed the gold plate. Not much more to report. The gear in the arena again couldn’t be taken without the use of an invisibility potion (see image). Then it was reachable without as much as a first alert. As before, it’s up to the individual player. Flares are pure junk, so I left them be. There were some arrows too, but still wasn’t worth it. Site 4 Nothing to report. Piece of cake, except for the equipment. Three water arrows, one gas arrow and an orb lay in one of the eastern ruins (see image). I could drop down alert-free east of the female archer up top, then sneak behind the buildings and peek out from the front corner of the ruin. Despite rushing, I couldn’t enter the doorway leading to the gear without raising havoc. Yet again, an invisibility potion made it available within Supreme rules (except the potion being a bust of course). Site 6 The only piece of loot here was the drill bit on top of the lift. It was an objective, but not mandatory since the objective wasn’t in the task list yet. I could reach it easily enough, by roping up a hole in the south ruins and dropping to a slope behind a lava pool. Getting back without alerts was the problem. Sliding down east of the lift was safe, but sneaking behind the bot into the aforementioned ruins ticked off the female sentry. I could jump onto and past the robot with only a first alert, but I wanted to keep Supreme intact for this one. I reloaded and brought a crate from close to site 3 to experiment. I found it was possible to mantle back up the ruin wall despite the ground being sloped. I couldn’t leave the crate though, so I had to grab it during the mantle. Garrett can actually grab the crate, then quickly jump and still make the mantle successfully (see image below). It was a little tricky to find the correct placement and angle, but also well worth it. No comments from the guard at all.  Site 1 The only objects in here worth mentioning were weapons. A mine and two fire arrows on the ground in the deep pit. There were more arrows and a piece of loot on the upper walkways, but they were all reachable without much trouble. I thought long and hard about how to approach the pit before I realized one of the switch mechanisms down there was operational. Most of the sites had similar machines either nonfunctional or just setting off the alarm. Operating the lights would obviously go against Supreme, but getting the gear within those rules wasn’t reasonable anyway. Reaching the switch from the dark tunnel proved difficult, so I thought of a different maneuver. The two closest guards have a conversation early on. One is muttering about extra work and the other is adjusting his attitude. They didn’t talk that long, but it was enough. From the high ledge to the west I could drop onto the alarm lights, and further onto the antenna machine underneath. From the corner on its south side I could reach the light switch out of view of the mech priest still talking (see image below). This enabled me to move around a lot more freely. Timing the female patroller I could sneak along the wall where the light was now off and grab the mine. Totally without comments. The fire arrows were tougher, as they were still lit up by the spot lights east of the big engine. I dropped onto it from the big silo above and this luckily kept me away from said lights. Inching to the engine’s west margin I could drop to the ground, snag the arrows and mantle back up directly (see image). I got chatter from the whole bunch, but all within plain Ghost rules. I put auto-equip to ‘off’ first just to be sure. I could mantle back up via the lights and the pipe. Although it wasn’t necessary, I like to return everything to how it was, so I turned the lights back on. Received some more comments in the process. On my way out I heard another settling remark from the southeastern guard down below. I realized he must have alerted from the sound of the switch being operated. Sometimes they give delayed settling remarks from those alerts.  Unhooking the Caboose Ok, it was time for the big move. For those of you unfamiliar with the problem, I’ll quickly break it down for you. Cavador and his two buddies don’t patrol in the traditional fashion. In fact, the only one with the “normal” patrol is the guy in the front. He is vulnerable to knockouts of any kind. Cavador’s patrol is linked to his. He follows him wherever he goes. Cavador can be blackjacked but not gassed. The backmost guard has Cavador as his lead, following him in the same fashion as the two in front. He is susceptible to gas arrows but not the blackjack. In addition, blackjacking Cavador makes a lot of noise, enough to alert anyone within a 10 meter distance or so. That whole setup makes for a very difficult kidnap. There is thus a dire need to separate the three of them, and therein lies the conundrum. Sneak found the best place to do so at the northern end of site 3. There is a small hole in the wall directly above a gas lamp. Close to this location is an earthen ramp. This is the perfect place to block the patrolling iron beast and consequently the Cavador-trio. It was necessary to douse the lamp from the ledge of the hole first. There was no way to complete the “unhooking” without that lamp being out. With that light source gone, it was possible to get the equipment from the footlockers below without any alerts. I had to time all the patrollers and both watchers, but I could drop to the alarm machine below via the various ledges on the north side (see image). The eastern wall down there was fairly dark, although it could set off the watcher on the level above. I mantled the engine and dropped onto the footlocker on the opposite side. From here I snuck over to the ladder and waited at the top. When the coast was clear I rushed and hid in the corner to the east of this next footlocker, grabbing the gas mines on the way. I was safe from any alerts here if crouching (see image). The male patroller came close, but his route was just far enough away not to notice. I could escape by encircling counterclockwise, but that always spawned a first alert from the female patroller. She never had her back fully turned, and the east wall was very bright. Instead I waited until they both headed north like in the picture. With a little luck, the iron beast was also facing away. Timing the watcher I then climbed the ladder in the southwest corner and rushed along the south wall to exit. Not a single peep from anyone. Great! I hauled three boxes from the site 4 train tracks and one from the site 2 storage room. They were the closest I could find. What made this entire upcoming set of moves a lot easier is when I found you could mantle the aforesaid gas lamp directly from the ground. Then I could mantle up the hole while staying completely dark. This meant I didn’t have to think about running around the room or making a box-staircase once the opportunity to blackjack Cavador presented itself. I could wait on top of the lamp and observe their movements. To prep the stage I placed a stack of two boxes a good crate-length out from the corner, right at the top of the ramp. I needed two because, although the iron beast only needed one to be blocked, human enemies passes straight through single boxes and needs a double stack to get jammed. This was a very safe obstruction for the robot. I didn’t ever see him budge and squeeze through. The third box was placed by his left foot close to the wall. This was to force the patrollers around the bot so they didn’t get stuck in the corner by his furnace. The box didn’t block them, but AIs do attempt to move around objects of this kind. Anyway, this was enough to lead them around on the right. The fourth and last was put at an angle out from the robots right leg. This was only to prevent him from moving around and letting the trio through too easily when they came back. This was the hooking juncture, so I didn’t want the setup to give them too much of an opportunity to wedge between him and the corner. The image below shows my final system. This would prove to be the successful one.  Cavador and his team came strolling about 7.5 minutes after reading the papyrus. The lead guard (Sneak calls him the Engine) pushed past the robot on his way back fairly easily. It didn’t take more than 20 seconds or so for him to continue his patrol. Cavador started running once the lead got a fair bit away. I quicksaved, and every time 10 seconds or so passed by without Cavador getting through, I saved again. Occasionally he would get through on the south side, around the two-box stack. As the lead passed in the tunnel behind me, Cavador finally crammed past the robot and kept running around the site (see image). The hind guard (the Caboose) was still stuck. I saved here and waited for Cavador to come by. He did and then conveniently stopped in the sloping cave to the west (see image below). This wasn’t a fluke as replaying the scenario several times generated the same outcome. I happily clobbered him. The Caboose had gotten through at this point, but too late to hear the thump. He stopped in the site’s southern ramp once Cavador was out of commission (see image). I deposited Cavador’s body in the empty ruins to the west of the path leading to site 5. I had to go rob his quarters before the lead guard returned.  Site 5 The only real issue here was getting to the upper floor unseen. I couldn’t fool the watcher and had to rope up the beam in the hall to its west. There was a stationary guard and a watcher upstairs. The guard turned frequently, but I could safely monitor him from downstairs. I managed to avoid a comment by keeping a loose drawstring and placing the arrow as horizontally as possible. If it hung straight down, the guard would see it and say something like: “This is not the work of a mechanist!” Those comments don’t have settling remarks, but counts as first alerts nonetheless. Climbing the line I could hide from the guard’s view behind the beam (see image below). Timing the watcher I then hopped northwest and hid behind the pillars.  Cavador’s room had a single patroller, but she was no problem to deal with. I could follow her and stop at the end of her patrol as she turned. Took the loot from this floor and headed downstairs. The purse and the flash bomb in the southeast bedroom were inaccessible for Supreme. The sleeping guard awoke when picking the footlocker. I could still avoid hunt mode by picking it from on top of the other chest (see image below). Had to backtrack upstairs, through Cavador’s, and slip down from the north side behind the camera.  Went back to site 3 and returned all the crates to their original location. Relit the gas lamp as I mantled up the hole for the last time. The iron beast was happily back at his patrol. I replaced Cavador’s key and the itinerary papyrus for Supreme. Picked up his body back at the ruins and headed for the exit. Site 9 The watcher at the entrance proved difficult until I found the right method, then it was a walk in the park. I simply sprinted from the left opening as the watcher started to swing away (see image). It turned all the way to the back wall, giving plenty of time for me to enter the room around the left corner. I spent a long time trying to hide directly underneath the watcher and run straight along the wall here, but could never get that to work. The first method proved better. Finished the mission upstairs. Supreme failed, but without a single first alert! Notes & Busts - Had to skip the gold nugget (100) in the chest at Site 8 for Supreme. The stationary mechanist on the floor below alerted from the lockpicks. - Skipped another piece of loot (20) on the outside table at Site 7 for Supreme. The stationary mechanist in the yard commented, and I wasn’t able to find a way around it. - Skipped the equipment (noisemaker, flash bomb and healing potion) inside the western control room at Site 7. It busted even plain Ghost trying to get in there. - Skipped 4 flares and 3 broadheads in the arena at site 2. There was no way to get it without a bust. - More gear was skipped at site 4 (water arrows, gas arrow and scouting orb) for the same reasons as above. - Site 1 had one mine and two fire arrows that couldn’t be taken within Supreme rules. I had to turn off the light to reach either, and received first alerts from all four stationary guards when taking the fire arrows. Received further first alerts when turning the lights back on, although this isn’t required following plain Ghost rules. - Had to stack four boxes on the patrol route of the site 3 iron beast to “unhook” Cavador and the Caboose and thus complete the kidnapping objective. This is a Supreme bust. It is also considered an engine exploit, but that is allowed as a last resort for plain Ghost. One water arrow was needed to douse the gas lamp nearby. Another Supreme bust. All the crates were returned and the lamp relit. - Knocking out Cavador is implied by the objective. No bust of any kind. - Skipped a purse (100) and a flash bomb in the southwest bedroom at site 5 for Supreme. The sleeping guard alerted from the lockpicks. - Couldn’t close the bay doors to the K.D. site. Supreme bust.
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports Last edited by Klatremus; 05-22-2012 at 04:58 PM.
|
|
#86
05-22-2012, 04:56 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Game: Thief 2 - The Metal Age
OM: Mission 13 - Casing the Joint Ghost - Success Perfect Thief - Success Supreme Ghost - Possibly Perfect Supreme - Failed Time - 52:23 Loot - 2685/2685 [Supreme: 2645] Pockets Picked - 9/10 Locks Picked - 1 Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 0 Damage dealt - 1, Damage taken - 0 Healing taken - 0, Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 0 Secrets - 9/9 Consumables - None See the entire report with screenshots here. Loot list here. Areas marked in blue only concern non-loot, non-objective related items. Comments: I could write an entire report on how bad of a mission ‘Casing the Joint’ is, but I’m not going to. I won’t let myself expend that much energy. The designers clearly didn’t. I dare say that if this and ‘Trace the Courier’ had been removed, Thief 2 would have been a better game, and considerably so. You can talk about rushing to make the launch date all you want, ‘Casing the Joint’ should never have made the final release. And with the immediate regurgitation come ‘Masks’, it’s beyond my comprehension how it was even considered. Most mediocre fan missions are more enjoyable. Anyway, you get the point. I was to stake out Gervaisius’ manor in order to successfully steal his precursor masks later. I had to find his secret stairway and whatever correspondence he’d undertaken with the mechanists. In addition, two strange objectives were to uncover seven secrets and half of the map. Lastly, I had to escape to the streets in the east. Outside The biggest challenges came outside the mansion in the west. A total of four purses were found on stationary guards in this area. The two problematic ones were on the first and second floor balconies. Both guards were stationed outside doors that spawned comments when utilized, the obvious intended way to pilfer the loot. Well, Supreme didn’t allow for first alerts, so I had to put my thinking cap on. I could ascend to the uppermost balcony using three boxes on the south shed (see image below). The outer rim up here was dark enough to allow me to encircle counterclockwise to the pillar closest to the pursed guard (see image).  All outside guards had the same pivoting pattern; three facing angles, never resting for more than 2-3 seconds in either position. This guard’s angles were southwest, west and northwest. The two latter were safe for me to creep-crouch-strafe out from the shade and over to the double doors (see image below). He caught me in the act several times by turning southwest before I reached safety. I guess I reloaded 5 or 6 times before getting it right. It was just a matter of retrying and being patient. Had to use the same method to get back around said pillar.  To move further north I flung a vine into the southeast corner of the wooden overhang. To eliminate noise (and hence a Supreme bust) when attaching to the vine, I crouch-walk-jumped onto it. That usually removes the clunk from Garrett’s boots. I could mantle the roof, retrieve the vine and slowly make my way to the northwest corner (see image). Both guards could still hear my footsteps. With a little accuracy I could hop over to the next roof, past the gap made by the wall. I was now situated above the second guard with a purse. I tried dropping onto the lamp by the door, but it was too great of a fall to eliminate damage. Instead I used another vine. I had to shoot the arrow from the corner to the west. That way I got the arrow to stick out far enough to be able to grab hold of it from above. I climbed about halfway down and waited (first image below). The next move was tricky, very tricky. As the guard swung northwest, I jumped onto the lamp. This was completely silent. From top of the light fixture, the guard could be positioned northwest and west without seeing me. If he turned southwest, I was caught. After the tenth reload or so he turned west, then back northwest, and that’s when I made my move. I slid down onto the step and snuck into the dark corner by the door (second image below). There was enough room to avoid a nudge (a Supreme bust) and I was safe regardless of his facing angle. To get back, I again waited for the northwest turn, then sprinted out to the left towards the vine. As soon as I hit the marble I had to slow down and pray he didn’t turn southwest again. This also took quite a few tries, but in the end I had him. He stayed facing northwest long enough for me to sneak a little bit out from the rope. Then I could make my small crouch-walk-hop and quickly climb to the top. Done deal! 1  2  I dropped to the overhang directly west of the second floor balcony, then to the grass below. The two remaining purses down here were no problem whatsoever. I returned the crates to the pile by the shed and entered through the secret entrance. Inside The guard by the street entrance turned around during the conversation with the lady. I saw that as maybe being a way around having to nudge him, so I didn’t trigger their conversation yet. She just remained standing by the western entrance. The rest of this floor was a breeze. The second floor was more of the same. Lots of coin pairs spread around, in seemingly random locations. One behind a covered couch in the north control room (see image). Two more were suspended in mid-air in the dining room (see image). Yet another pair of coins was found on the ledge next to the turret in the south hall (see image). I could easily sneak over on its east side without getting caught. The camera in the southeast hall was turned off, but the turret was fully operational still. This prevented me from being able to reach the office here (see image). I tried to enter through the window using a vine arrow from the first floor, but to no avail. I got stuck in the window frame and could never get through. I tried multiple ways of attaching the vine, leaning, jumping and swinging around, but no progress was made. It ended up being the only skip for Supreme, a total of 40 gold. For plain Ghost I could easily turn off the turret and enter normally. Cleared the library and found the secret staircase via the clock. I skipped the top floor altogether. All that was up there at this point were three worthless masks. For extreme purists, they can be taken without any first alerts. It involves vine arrowing over the first lookout window to pass the swordsman’s view. The frame have a small ledge that keeps you out of his vision. Back in the downstairs foyer I was ready to leave. I triggered the conversation and could surprisingly sneak all the way over to the double doors (see image below). Not a single peep from either of them. I stole his purse, picked the lock and rushed out to finish the mission. I still consider this a possible Supreme bust. I know it doesn’t go against any specific rule, but I feel it clashes with that mode’s spirit. It tastes too much like an exploit to grant the success. I’ll leave it to the readers to decide.  Notes & Busts - Had to skip 40 gold in the second floor office southwest of the foyer for Supreme. The turret outside caught me going for the entry door. Had to turn it off for plain Ghost. - Had to exit to the streets during the guard’s conversation with the sorceress. The alternative was nudging, which is a last resort option only. I didn’t get any first alerts during the process, but I still see it as a possible Supreme bust.
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports
|
|
#87
05-30-2012, 09:13 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Game: Thief 2 - The Metal Age
OM: Mission 14 - Masks Ghost - Success Perfect Thief - Success Supreme Ghost - Success Perfect Supreme - Failed Time - 2:07:52 Loot - 3667/3667 [Supreme: 3597] Pockets Picked - 11/12 Locks Picked - 20 Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 0 Damage dealt - 0, Damage taken - 0 Healing taken - 0, Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 0 Secrets - 3/3 Consumables - None See the entire report with screenshots here. Loot list here. Areas marked in blue only concern non-loot, non-objective related items. Comments: Definitely an upgrade from ‘Casing the Joint’, but still far from a great mission. The map regurgitation automatically makes it dull, but on its own it’s fairly interesting. I especially like the third floor. I feel a scary basement is needed though, or at least a changeup from the monotonous wooden surroundings. At this point, my mind was already in Soulforge Cathedral, though I enjoyed my time through ‘Masks’ as much as I was able to. Back to Gervasius’ to grab the three masks. Finding the correspondence objective was already checked off. I needed a cultivator and 2,800 in loot also. That was it. I’ll keep the report rather brief, only pointing out areas of interest for Ghosters. Refer to the loot list for secrets and hidden items. First Floor Venturing east on the first floor I needed to pass through the workshop. A camera prevented the hall from being utilized past this point. The door to the control room was pickable, but the area beyond the doorway was lit up. The woman by the bed was facing the door and alerted if I snuck out. The image below shows the sweet spot before hitting the light. From here I had to crouch, then rush out and come to a halt. This normally kept her silent. There is a slight delay before the light gem kicks in. If you’re out of sight by that time, enemies won’t see you. That was the case here.  The most challenging difference between this mission and ‘Casing the Joint’ was that most doors were locked, and picking them usually took a long time. I therefore saw the offices close to the foyer on the second floor as potential busts. Before getting that far I stole the torc from the safe in the northernmost of these offices through the window (see image). The hall below was heavily patrolled, but I found a gap in the routes and managed to get the loot safely. There was one more purse in each of these offices out of reach from the windows. They would have to be skipped if I couldn’t dodge the cameras upstairs. I’d have to wait and see. The ballroom was quite tricky. I screen captured the map and filled in walls, loot locations and enemies with patrols. The arrow shows the only point of entry for Supreme. I never tried vine arrowing from the upper floor. The stationary archers covered the ground well upon entry. Both faced east. Then you had the dangerous patrolling archer on the upstairs catwalk. I had to creep-crouch-strafe into the northeastern cubby and steal the loot here first. The circling swordsman had an interesting route, quite challenging in fact. I made my way behind the middle wall in the west before he completed a full loop. The black dots show safe locations. Once I saw a fifth enemy patrol in the south end, but I never saw him return so I don’t know if it was a fluke.  I couldn’t get to the barracks in the northeast without alerting the guard in the lookout room. I could sneak up to the corner of the archway, but not beyond (see image below). There were 70 gold in there that had to be skipped for Supreme. Received a total of three comments. Managed to avoid alerts from both patrollers. If wanting the stationary guard’s key, I had to accept three additional first alerts. Amazingly, I could take it leaning around the corner to the front (see image).  Supreme required lifting one of the patrollers’ yellow keys. They worked on a variety of doors spread around the first floor. In particular the following: - Door to control room in the northwest - Door to kitchen - Door to servants’ quarters - Double doors to marbled staircase in the northeast - Door from hall to control room in the southeast - Door connecting control room with workshop - Door from hall to chapel More doors than these responded to the yellow key, but they were all unlocked at the start of the mission, hence no need to relock them for Supreme. Second Floor The bedroom in the northwest was a real pickle. It contained two pieces of loot and a sleeping guest. The door was pickable, but a camera was stationed directly outside the entrance. It was placed on the south wall, swinging 90˚ west and about 60˚ east. A latch on the inside of the hall archway opened a hidden entrance that took me to the watcher’s east side. The door was more approachable from here. There was a dark nook just east of the camera where I could monitor the patrolling swordsman (see image below). His route was limited to this hallway with one exception. He took a small stroll down the side hall towards the staircase to the first floor. This was my saving grace. Keep in mind that this is Supreme Ghost, so turning off the watcher wasn’t allowed. As the guard headed down the hallway I could time the swings and pick the door for about one second before having to return to the shade. Usually I had to wait one extra swing cycle after he swooped through the arch to go for the pick. Otherwise he would comment when I stepped on the tiles by the door. If he was further away he didn’t hear. Occasionally I got two picks like this in before he returned. Normally though I had to wait until he did his entire round before doing the next second’s worth of picking. This was very tedious, taking about 8 patrol rounds before I finally got the lock open.  Now I had to enter the room without waking the guest or alerting the guard. To do that I leapt over the tiles and land at the foot of the west door jamb (see image). Timing of the watcher had to be perfect, but eventually I got inside and out of view safely. After taking the loot, I dodged the camera westward. The next problem was accessing the office in the far east of this hall. As mentioned, I had already taken the torc from the safe by the use of a vine arrow. There was one more piece of loot in there though. This hall also had a watcher, in the far northeast corner. It had a more acute angle than the one described above, giving me less time to work with. However, there was a convenient rafter blocking its view under the ceiling. I exploited this by placing a vine arrow on the rafter’s west side, as high up as possible (first image below). I then struck a second into the wall directly above the office door. Both of these were shot from the dark portion of the dining room doorway. The patroller didn’t alert to the vines placed like this, but I did hear him comment on other configurations. I suggest you check and wait until he passes before saving. By timing the watcher perfectly, I could now climb the first vine and stay out of its view. I lowered myself a tad and hopped onto the second. Here I was able to pick the lock while attached to the vine (second image below). It was important the vine was attached to the wall and not the ceiling, otherwise Garrett would hang too far out to reach the lock. The door would only open partly once it unlocked. I thus had to leap back to the first vine, turn around, retrieve the second arrow, open the door fully and finally drop to the floor by grabbing the first arrow. This last drop had to be done as the camera turned to the far south. That way I could dash into the office before getting caught. 1  2  I’m not going to lie, this was a highly satisfying set of moves to keep within Supreme rules. It took quite a number of reloads and much experimentation to get right. Once having cleared the office I could leap into the window and descend using another vine arrow. I then had to return upstairs to close the dining room door. I found the easiest way to the south part of the second floor via the south storage room. That also took me through the ballroom where I picked up the loot from the rafter and the broadheads from the patrolling archer. No issues until I reached the guard station in the southeast. I think the guy in there is involved in a conversation and then turns east to face the door. He was embedded in his chair and couldn’t move, but he still alerted like normal. He commented on the door opening and saw me entering the doorway. His window could be passed both ways without alerts by crouch-hugging the frame. I had to find a way to land on the windowsill in order to get the loot inside without busts. I tried with a vine arrow, but there wasn’t enough room to swing onto the ledge. I could partly jump onto it, but not with enough of a foothold to enable crouching. In the end, I sought to stacking. Two healing potions, one slow-fall potion, a deer leg and a horn did the job (see image below). Check the loot list for their respective locations. I had to back out from the window a few inches before starting the stack, otherwise I’d bounce away from the wall when jumping onto the first item. The stack took me an inch or so above the ledge and I could slip inside silently. I used the desk to leave in similar fashion. I could just inch my way off the edge and back into the hallway without making noise. Returned all the objects for Supreme.  The last room on this floor was the office southwest of the foyer. Again a camera protected the hall and the entry door had to be picked. The difference was the door across from it was further away. This called for the use of all three arrows. A good thing was the door frame kept me out of view of the camera, so I could close the door and hide while placing my arrows. Similar to before I shot one arrow into the wall above the door and another into the north-south going rafter above the edge of the carpet. The last one I placed in the ceiling just beyond the east-west going rafter. The image below shows my successful configuration. As the guard strolled west I made a leap for arrow 1. This was an easier move than the equivalent one outside the north office. I could hop to arrow 2 without alerts and turn around to retrieve my first arrow, no use for that anymore. From here I picked the lock and closed the door once done. I leapt to arrow 3, turned around and opened the door again. Jumped back to arrow 2, turned around to grab arrow 3 and took the final arrow to enter the office. Like before, this last drop depended on timing the camera. I couldn’t see its pivots from above the door, so it ended up being a lucky shot. Every time I reloaded I simply waited a fraction of a second longer before dropping; eventually I found the opening.  Third Floor Not much to report from the top floor. Used the rafters to grab all the loot and the masks. The arrows in the terrarium was a tricky challenge, but got them without any comments from the servant. The most difficult part was getting the cultivator. I had to wait for the archer to cycle through twice before he and the robot synchronized beneficially. As the iron beast patrolled north I jumped across the marble and grabbed the objective. Notes & Busts - Received three comments going for the loot in the first floor barracks. This had to be skipped for Supreme, as first alerts are not allowed for that mode. Needed to take three more comments if wanting his key.
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports
|
|
#88
06-14-2012, 07:50 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I haven't checked here in a while, Klatremus, but you have been busting your butt this last month! Three missions, including the beast that is Kidnap! Thanks so much!
Maybe more posts after a detailed read...
__________________
A true professional doesn't leave a mess. My YouTube channel-Thief Ghosting videos!
|
|
#89
06-14-2012, 08:11 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Kidnap: I am extremely impressed with your crate maneuver in Site 6, one of my biggest trouble spots, and even more impressed with your discovery of the gas lamp mantle. You actually improved on Sneak's methods-not an easy task. Well done!
Casing: I am glad you agree with my assessment of this garbage mission. The biggest problem is how much it hurts Masks, which would've been a pretty good mission had you not just been to the exact same map. Casing's presence makes Masks an irritant as well. As far as the actual Supreme Ghost run, I am extremely impressed with your vine arrow resourcefulness to get the purses with no first alerts. I don't consider your use of the conversation to escape a Supreme bust-you're just observing that the AIs are occupied and taking advantage of it. You are awesome. That is all. Masks: Your handling of the ballroom is quite impressive, as is your 8-patrol-round lockpicking on the second floor. Your vine arrow maneuvering into the office which gave me so much trouble, your object stack for the troublesome guard post, and the way you handled the guard barracks are all nothing short of genius.
__________________
A true professional doesn't leave a mess. My YouTube channel-Thief Ghosting videos!
|
|
#90
06-15-2012, 02:00 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Thank you so much for your kind words, Travis!
I didn't watch your videos farther than LotP, so I didn't know about your trouble spots besides what you mentioned in your reports. I will get through the remaining videos soon I hope. It is true that several of the last missions had a few surprising situations that had to be dealt with in unconventional fashion. I am sorry you feel Kidnap isn't that good of a mission, I rather enjoy it. I have done my BJ-run through Soulforge and as you maybe saw from my reply in the other thread, I agree that it isn't Ghostable. I am currently visiting my family in Scandinavia, but will Ghost and report on it when I return next month. Will probably delve into some more FMs after that. There are still a few classics I'd like to visit. As I've said before, I would absolutely love to see your videos of some of those. I have plenty of FM reports on my site already. The Black Frog that I mentioned a while back comes highly recommended. See you've been busy with Deus Ex lately though. Never got into those games really. Too much to play, and lately it has only been Thief, and I'm hardly complaining about that. Good to have you back!
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports
|
|
#91
06-16-2012, 09:24 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I do like Kidnap. It's Casing the Joint I hate.
__________________
A true professional doesn't leave a mess. My YouTube channel-Thief Ghosting videos!
|
|
#92
06-19-2012, 12:54 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I thought I had read somewhere that you didn't care for Kidnap. I apologize, my bad. Yeah Casing is disgraceful.
 Watching your Kidnap playthrough now. Good stuff! There are crates much closer to Site 3 than the ones you hauled over, but I guess that's not a big deal. The gas lamp mantle was a nice, though coincidental, find. It helped eliminate any first alerts during the kidnapping for me. The entire mission could be ghosted without first alerts in fact, though you need to skip some loot. I know you don't like that. I managed to avoid some first alerts during Precious Cargo also. I just finished watching that playthrough. Captain Markham, entering into the flooded cave [very difficult], and exiting the pirate base. I remain convinced you're not utilizing your key bindings to the full. It seems to me you are tapping the run key while creeping, which generates sudden small bursts of increases to the light gem, instead of walk+creep (or strafe+creep, my favorite) which is slower, but more steady and completely hidden. Your videos are awesome by the way!
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports
|
|
#93
07-27-2012, 11:52 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Game: Thief 2 - The Metal Age
OM: Mission 15 - Sabotage at Soulforge Ghost - Failed Perfect Thief - Failed Supreme Ghost - Failed Perfect Supreme - Failed Time - 2:31:16 Loot - None Pockets Picked - None Locks Picked - 6 Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 0 Damage dealt - 0, Damage taken - 0 Healing taken - 0, Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 1 Secrets - 4/4 Consumables - None See the entire report with screenshots here. Loot list here. Areas marked in blue only concern non-loot, non-objective related items. Comments: While not the best mission in the game, ‘Sabotage at Soulforge’ stands out to me as a good end to an average campaign. Thief 2 has 5-6 great missions, while the rest are par for the course or worse. 3-4 of them are absolutely terrible. This mission separates itself as being different, and different in a good way, something the designers didn’t dare try as much as they should have. I really enjoy exploring through Soulforge Cathedral, the ultimate creation of this mechanical faction. Viktoria had already made her way into the cathedral, and I was left alone to stop Karras. My main objective was to redirect his servants back to Soulforge Cathedral. I needed to find information on how to use the guiding beacon in order to accomplish this. My tasks would get more specific then. I wasn’t to let Karras in on my plan, an objective I still don’t know how to fail. Lastly, I had to leave the cathedral in one piece. Unfortunately, my Ghost run was busted the very second I started (see image below). I definitely think the watcher is intended to spot you, as a way to make Karras’ announcement seem deliberate, but that doesn’t prevent the bust. I tried buying an invisibility potion, but there was no way to get to it in time. It seemed like the camera started in yellow, but it always made the second alert noise and turned to follow me; clear signs of detection. Like with ‘Trail of Blood’, I do think the original archived community assumed the exception, but I don’t. I was still intent on Ghosting (or even Supreming) the remainder of the mission though. Some players might disagree, but I have a much easier time accepting these kinds of busts than the ones where I feel there might be a way to avoid it. The mission didn’t have any loot or pickpockets, so I added the extra challenge of trying to steal all the gear, including all the production resources spread around the compound. My goal was also to manufacture the three secret weapons, thereby visiting all the machine bays. I would skip the infamous quote scroll, as it involved killing several combat bots. Parts relating to the stealing of gear will be marked in blue, as it is unnecessary for plain Ghost and disallowed (and thus skipped) for Supreme.  Machine Bays I could move quite freely around the machine bays. Some areas would occasionally get crowded, but the patrollers had routes long enough to easily wait them out. A watcher and a patrolling bot forced me up a ledge in the east (see image). I had to pass this area in order to get to the storage rooms and retrieve the required items for the guiding beacon. Got new objectives in the plans room that specified guiding beacon production and deactivation of 7 out of 8 signal towers. Revealed the secret study by mantling up the end of the open safe door. Didn’t have to use a vine arrow that way. It wasn’t retrievable without taking damage anyway. Opened the northern apse and left the study open. I would return to close them both later. Initially I thought I had to circle the entire area counterclockwise to return to bay C. The aforementioned ledge around the watcher seemed too high up to warrant a harmless drop. But I found an efficient way to drop onto the staircase railing safely. Hitting the wall just before landing kept me unharmed. This sped things up considerably. I could now move straight back to the starting area and begin assembling the beacon. The entire assembly process was carried out with no trouble. Had to be careful in bay A as the bots here were on high alert due to the scattered mech bodies. Bay B/C had a dangerously roaming spider bot. I only moved when it had its back turned, just to stay on the safe side. Took the secret tunnel to bay D. Was careful to listen for alerts when producing the beacon pieces here. The blind bots alerted to the thumps of the objects exiting the machines. The 3 water arrows in the pool here couldn’t be obtained without a comment from the stationed iron beast. Skip these if you wish to stick to Supreme rules. Entered bay E through the overhead walkway. Hopped onto the north camera overhang and furthermore onto the generator (see image). Reached the production machine this way. Left through the secret panel. Reset the plans room immediately after installing the finished guiding beacon. I like to get things done right away. Signal Towers The frogbeast egg among the foliage outside the west entrance to the barracks couldn’t be stolen without multiple first alerts. I had to douse the nearest torch also. Accepting those Supreme violations, I could rush into the grate alcove and lean out from the shade (see image). If you don’t care about using the arrow, be my guest. I don’t use eggs, I just wanted to see if it could be done. I had no real problems until the underground exploratory inventing workshop. A watcher guarded the conventional entry in intimidating fashion. I could turn off the lights to pass it, but that was against Supreme rules, plus I found another way around. I could drop into the water from the upper hall to the north (first image below). The lone mechanist stationed on a ramp below didn’t alert. I could mantle up the metal wall to the chute ladder without any comments, despite my light gem going red (second image below). This area was also out of view of any of the cameras. The mantles were tough and had to be done close to the west wall. Check the red arrow in the image below. The first mantle was up the metal slope. I had to let go of the jump key before completing the move, to avoid the typical “clunk”. To get further up without making noise I had to crouch-run, then mantle again. I heard no remarks, although it was tough to tell over the generator. I could only tell whether he said something, not what he said. If I heard him talk, I reloaded and tried again. I set the ladder option to ‘touch’ and climbed the signal tower. To slide back down to the lever side I leaned out and shot a vine arrow into the carpet. The vine ended up hanging down onto the slope. I inched over and Garrett caught hold with a small jerk. From here I could turn around and back up slowly to descend. As I reached the end I slid down and grabbed the rope in the process. Nice to get out of that one clean!   The room with the patrolling iron beast in the same workshop couldn’t be reached without turning off the lights. The door was protected by the aforementioned camera and the window couldn’t be mantled. I didn’t find useful stackables either and wasn’t in the mood to search. If you want the goodies in there, go ahead and kill the lights. Then it was easy enough. To avoid a chirp (first alert) from the watcher, however, thing got more complicated. The doorway was too bright to be utilized, but the adjacent window was dark. Jumping into it was possible, but not without the watcher alerting. There was only a tiny flicker in the light gem, but that was enough to receive the first alert. The only way to avoid it was creating a stack of six scrolls and one explosive charge (see image). Then I could slide onto the sill and out of view. The tower in the computer room to the far southeast wasn’t a problem. It was only a matter of dodging all the iron beasts and flipping the gate levers. The tower just to the west of this was harder still. A stuck spider bot outside the chapel (more on him later) made access to the metal rafters difficult. It blocked the way to the intended chute. I had to use an alternate way via the tunnels in the abovementioned computer room. Once there, a watcher covered a lit-up portion above the second water tank. Choosing the right moment, I could strafe-run past the two lamps and come to a halt as it swung back to face me (see image below). Luckily, this spot was dark enough to avoid alerts of any kind. There wasn’t much time to spare and maximum speed was of essence. The iron beast stationed by the elevator didn’t detect anything going on atop the rafters, and I could safely make my way to the signal tower. I used a vine arrow into the ceiling grate when returning. Plunged into the tank and climbed over the edge while monitoring the camera.  The hall outside the chapel was the access point to the remaining two towers. Unfortunately, the previously mentioned spider bot was still stuck (see image below). In fact, I have never played this mission and not seen something getting stuck there. You cannot rush into the south opening and avoid hunt mode. You can get by with backtracking and dousing a torch outside the barrack’s main entrance, but that busts Supreme. The trick to solving this problem with Supreme intact is finding one of the three other robots patrolling the same route. To my knowledge, two other spider bots and an iron beast do exactly that. There might be a mechanist or two that also venture down there from time to time. Anyway, the robots have set paths with random pivot points in certain locations, making their routes semi-predictable. If studying their patrols, you can learn the locations of the pivot points and quicksave right before they reach one. If the robot turns and you didn’t want it to, simply reload and it might not turn the next time. If you follow one or more of these robots all the way to the chapel, they will eventually end up at the same ladder as the stuck spider. Once that happens, both will get freed due to a programmed response that causes both AIs to shift laterally, thus rounding the ladder altogether. In my case, all three robots found themselves in bay A, forcing a rather lengthy addition to the playthrough just to deal with this problem. Once found, I had no trouble following them to the chapel and freeing the other bot as explained.  The barracks had one troublesome item; a healing potion in a pickable footlocker. It was in a brightly lit area straight out from another pivoting watcher. The closest place to wait was in a dark alcove in the northeast (see image). From here I could make lockpick-runs while the camera swung west. I needed three such runs to undo the lock and get the potion. The last towers went by worrilessly. Used the passageway from the trap-maze tower to bypass the furnace room with all the wandering mechanists. This saved me quite a bit of work. Utilized the shades carefully to bypass the cameras and the iron beast to reach the tower across the pit. I did give the turret production facility a wholehearted shot. I just couldn’t pass up a room that intimidating without a fight. Sneaking along the most shaded route I could find, I actually made it quite far. Farther than I thought at least. The last walkway towards the tower itself ended up being the end of me. The image below shows the sweet spot before getting nailed by the turret on my left. As you can see, I even got the tower gate open. If property damage had been allowed, I could’ve easily downed two of them. One flinging a scouting orb into the hydraulic press button, and a fire arrow into the explosive charge on the workbench. But none of that matters much. It was fun trying anyhow. I’m not sure how to interpret turret alerts, but I counted a turning noise as a first alert, then a shot as a Ghost bust.  The last skipped area was another machine room close to the chapel. It was guarded by a golden child staring straight down a long, brightly lit hall (see image). There was no way to circumvent him, not even by waiting for him to fidget. He idled differently compared to his Angelwatch counterpart. There were no real issues leaving the compound. Several bots had gotten stuck in or near bay A, but nothing I couldn’t sneak past. Overall, I Supreme Ghosted the entire mission bar the watcher in the beginning. If you excuse that bust, then this mission is Supremable; though I’m always too hard on myself to allow such justifications. With that, Thief 2: The Metal Age is done and I’m off to pilfer some fan mission. See you next time! Notes & Busts - Failed all modes immediately upon starting the mission. Karras’ watcher spotted me right away. - Skipped the quote scroll in bay A, as it involved the killing of three iron beasts. - The three water arrows in bay D couldn’t be taken without a comment from the nearby stationed iron beast. It heard the splash when entering the pool. - Getting the frogbeast egg outside the west barracks entrance necessitated the use of a water arrow. I also received several first alerts in the process. - The flux spheroid and the spring wiring in the exploratory inventing workshop couldn’t be obtained without shutting off the lights. After that, no further busts were necessary. - Couldn’t retrieve any of the items on the turret production facility workbenches. There was no way to get within reach safely. - Skipped all the items in the machine room beyond the golden child close to the chapel. He covered the only passable area. - The body discovered is one of the destroyed iron beasts in bay A. These are already present upon starting the mission and naturally no bust.
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports
|
|
#94
08-17-2012, 04:39 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
"Glad" may be the wrong word, but it's reassuring to see that the reigning King of Ghosting (I consider myself a prince at best) couldn't solve the initial Watcher either.
Good job maintaining Supreme in the Plans Room. I can't honestly remember if I tried and failed or simply didn't think of mantling on the safe doors, but either way, well done. For once, I think I managed something you didn't. IIRC, it's a fairly simple matter of timing to avoid even 1st alerts on the objects thumping in Bay D. (Bay D is the one with 2 machines, where the Regulating Round is made, right?) Your nontraditional maneuvering through the inventing workshop is genius. l did think of going through "backwards" like you did by starting through the water, but never got past the watcher. How did you manage it? Your solution to the stuck spiderbot was genius. I never managed to overcome that, so well done. I would like to see you take a crack at Thief 3, but I know you don't like it and are busy besides. My wife is a nanny and I've helped her out before, so I have some idea how time-consuming kids are. Nice work, King Ghost!
__________________
A true professional doesn't leave a mess. My YouTube channel-Thief Ghosting videos!
|
|
#95
08-17-2012, 07:08 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I am no King of Ghosting, rest assured. I'm simply one of the very few remaining. Back in the day you had Sneak, Vanguard, Dafydd, Hexameron, Peter Smith, Old Man, Lytha, and the list goes on. But thank you for your compliments. I simply try to have fun playing the most challenging way of the best game ever made, IMHO.
I toyed with the idea of doing some narrated videos like you, but realized it would take too long. I never play more than 30-40 minute stretches. My 7-month old daughter takes up too much time to allow for anything else. And spending my time with her is naturally much higher up on my list of priorities. The way I see it, you still Supremed the plans room, you just didn't find the mantle point of the safe door. No problem getting objects as long as they're returned. I didn't alert the bots in bay D btw, I just meant I had to be careful not to. They took me by surprise and commented a few times before I got it right. I guess I should've worded that differently in the report. If you take the route I did in the inventing workshop you don't have to deal with no watcher. You take the side door before you reach it, and the second watcher by the ladder chute doesn't see anything up on that platform. The biggest deal was the stationary mechanist servant. The spiderbot deal was a complete fluke. The first time I did my practice run there was another bot coming from behind him 30 seconds after he got stuck. That's when I saw the method could be used, without ever having thought of it myself. I can't take much credit for being lucky. Yeah I actually gave Thief 3 a shot, but it's just way too different. I have so many FMs for Thief 2 I want to try instead. Have you tried any? Hope things are holding up good in Chicago. We've got record temperatures here in Phoenix. 117 a few days in a row. Went down to "only" 100 today, thank goodness. Keep taffing!
__________________
Klatremus' Supreme Thief Site - Walkthroughs, Loot Lists & Ghost Reports
|
|
#96
03-18-2013, 01:44 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Sorry for bumping an old thread, but it seems like this place is pretty slow anyway, and this seemed the appropriate place to post this.
I'm extremely new to Thief. Just picked the games up during the Steam winter sale a few months ago, and have been playing through them slowly since. The ghosting concept (getting through without violence, without anyone having seen you there, and minimal evidence that anyone had ever come through) is something that has appealed to me in other stealth games, so stumbling on the ghosting rules and applying them to my playing of Thief was a natural fit. I'm starting in on a project to ghost as many levels as I can, and record them. I'm planning to do each as a single-segment (meaning I will do the entire mission start-to-finish without using any save/reload), but won't be going for Perfect Thief or Supreme Ghost with these (obviously that would make single-segment near impossible). Not really planning to go through the levels in order, but so far I've got a basic test run of Bafford's recorded and uploaded, and after that I'm going to record Metal Age's "Masks" level, once I've got my time down a bit. Also, should I include commentary or no? There are some youtube presenters whose commentary entirely ruins their videos, and others where it adds a lot, so I'm trying to decide one way or the other. Last edited by sdwoodchuck; 03-18-2013 at 01:58 PM.
|
|
#97
03-18-2013, 02:26 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Game: Thief Gold
OM: Mission 1 - Lord Bafford's Manor Ghost - Success Perfect Thief - Failed (ignored the gold ring (100) by the spiders) Supreme Ghost - Success Perfect Supreme - Failed (missed the ring, as above) Time - 53 minutes 26 seconds Loot - 1329 Pockets Picked - 2/4 Backstabs - 0, Knockouts - 0 Damage dealt - 0, Damage taken - 0 Healing taken - 0, Kills - 0, Bodies Discovered - 0 Consumables - None Intro / Hi again! Looks like about a year since my last post! I guess I'm not quite as dedicated as some of you guys and many other games / real life things always pull me away. Anyway all this talk about the "new Thief" made me realise how much better the old ones were. Okay, okay, cynical - but I can't be disappointed if I expect the worst. Anyway, I can't remember whether I gave up on Shipping...and Receiving but I felt more like Thief Gold this time. Started with the first mission (as you do) and we'll see whether I manage another before I disappear into the ether again. Approach In order to increase the time until burn-out, I've gone with the following approach:
Summary I ignored the ring in the box by the spiders to follow my "approach" above. I actually did the entire thing with boxes etc. when I first started before realising that I'd rather take the above approach and settle for a lesser goal. Not only did I do the entire thing, I also had just dismantled the boxes and was about to step back into the pool when I noticed I'd left the lid open.  I went back and did it again before deciding it wasn't my style for now!Anyway, I restarted, and just stuck to the rest of the loot and Supreme. The most tricky area really was the Throne Room entrance and that was only a matter of a few quick loads. Of course Bafford's is a small, symmetrical misssion with few guards, convenient darkness and quiet floors so it's not exactly the greatest of challenges! Still, a good (re)start to my ghosting. Detail I'll keep this brief as many have done better versions of this. It's mostly to highlight areas I had trouble with... The "pull lever and run under door" in the sewers initially gave me a bit of trouble but after my restarts (see above and below) I think I got it first or second attempt. The guard in the basement was a problem. I initially tried to move past him and couldn't but managed to hit jump or something and got him fully alerted. My save was before he got all the way to his post so I had to listen to a one-sided conversation about the state of Bafford's security. I then saved, went to try and move past and...he was almost in the damn cellar! He was noticeably closer than he had been my previous attempt so I realised it was futile. I therefore restarted (again) and made a full save before the guards start talking to see how variable this final position could be. As it turned out, on this attempt he seemed to gain a bit more momentum wandering through the doorway and ended up further than originally (or at least, as far) and with a bit of strafe wiggling I made it through undetected. I then crept carefully around the corner, getting more and more irritated by his muttering (that I kept thinking was a 1st alert). After that, I cleared the ground floor quite easily and headed upstairs. Upstairs was equally straightforward for the most part except for the Throne Room guard. He required a few reloads (although not as many as I had feared) and maybe a bit of luck as he turned to face south, then when I got nearly past him turned to face west which is about as helpful a combination as you could hope for. On the way out I watched until he faced west, then got partly past him and waited for him to turn south - again a helpful set of moves. Not complaining though! I pickpocketed one of the patrollers outside to get into the Throne Room area so I left his key on the carpeted part of the route. I am not particularly going for either high or low numbers of pickpockets but probably leaning more towards low. I could have avoided picking that guard's pocket at all if I wanted to use the key from the wall in the "hidden study" but I figure a guard dropping his key is more likely than a key falling off a hook on a wall. Maybe. Anyway that's all I think was noteworthy, its an incredibly easy mission to Ghost except for that one basement guard (who isn't really that bad if you don't get unlucky with his slightly random positioning) and the spiders (which I didn't do on this run) and maybe the Throne Room guard but that went okay this time. I don't think I'm going to do them in order as I prefer some missions to others and I'm not buying loot at the start anyway (i.e. mission skipping won't hurt). I think I might do Assassins next as ever since that second demo for Thief: The Dark Project that mission has held a special place - it simply blew me away back in 1998 and its still a huge amount of fun after tens of completions.
|
|
#98
03-18-2013, 02:44 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Heh - nothing since August 2012 and then two posts within an hour of each other.
Woodchuck, your video is very impressive. Look forward to seeing more of those - the "single segment" will be a challenge on some missions for sure! I thought you were going to run into that guard right at the end though, I could hear him walking and was thinking "why is he running towards him, he's definitely coming this way!". Comes from playing that level so much myself recently I guess. A first alert only at least and as you say, you're not going for Supreme. I guess to a great degree whether to include commentry will depend upon your abilities at making interesting commentry. I keep toying with the idea of doing videos for mine but I strongly suspect I'd manage to make my commentry boring. Still tempted though. :P You could always give it a go and see if you think it comes across well - I assume you mean commentry after the video (rather than during) as I imagine you'd need full concentration when not using saves / loads. Edit: Forgot to mention my first thought at your post. I'm so jealous of someone discovering Thief recently :P
|
|
#99
03-18-2013, 03:11 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I didn't hear the guard at all while I was playing the mission. My roommate, whose desktop is set up right next to mine, was playing Hotline Miami and the sound of that game was drowning out my own (in fact, just before that when I'm impatiently waiting for a patrol, you can see me doing the lean in-time with music that isn't there).
I've considered doing the commentary both ways; either as an addition afterward, or as a running commentary while playing. You're right that it takes a fair bit of concentration while playing to make the single-segment run happen, but there's also a LOT of wait time where I could fill that space with some talk with no real difficulty. In my test runs of Masks, there's so much wait time that I'm afraid with no commentary at all, that video would be very dry. As for just recently discovering Thief, it came as a surprise to me. I tend to be mostly a retro-gamer, but while I was passingly aware of the Thief games, they'd never been really brought to my attention until I saw they were on sale for some crazy low price, I looked into it, and decided to buy on a whim. I have been very, very impressed.
|
|
#100
03-19-2013, 01:56 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Started working on Assassins tonight. Did a "run around like a blackjacking lunatic" run including a SWAT-like entrance to the main guard post by the kitchens including flashbombs and liberal violence. Kinda cathartic after Supreme Ghosting Bafford's.
Anyway the purpose was achieved, in that I ended up with full loot so at least I should know where everything is! I was also hoping to identify any tricky sections for Ghosting but that didn't really work out (or at least I didn't identify any! I'll start a real attempt either tomorrow or Thursday...
|
 |
| Bookmarks |
| Thread Tools | |
| Display Modes | |
|
|
Linear Mode
