Grenades and other multiplayer issues

[Garrett Vega]

There's a bunch of things that made the multiplayer worse for players. I'd like to point them out, along with a question about grenades.

So, first of all, it's the rumored lack of grenades in Dog Days.

Though grenades are no longer a part of the Kane & Lynch universe, you can grab fire extinguishers and toss them at enemies while shooting them to create an improvised explosion.

This quote is from the giantbomb preview. I'd really like to know if that's true. And I'm more interested about the multiplayer, because while in the K&L1 single player grenades were useless (mostly because the AI didn't put up much of a fight), in Fragile Alliance they are very useful, mostly for flushing out human opponents out of cover and shooting them while they run for their soon to be over life. Without them combat will be more limited.

So would it be too much to ask for a confirmation from Nick?

Now, speaking of Fragile Alliance, there's a few issues that I'd really love to see get fixed.

One of them is getting marked as a traitor for self defense. In my experience this happens quite often: one player decides to be a traitor and starts shooting at me. Unfortunately for him, he uses the weak MP5 and I manage to get into cover before dying. So I get out of cover and manage to shoot him in the face first. And suddenly, I'm a traitor. How about that. Because of self defense, now I have a traitor sign and a 100k bounty on my head. And the rest of the team wants that 100k, along with the rest of my money. Is that supposed to be fair? Because if I want to be a traitor, I usually make the move when I can take the team out one by one, yet in these scenarios I have to battle them all at once.

Another problem is the police AI following the same path most of the time. I think there should be at least 2 or 3 ways for the AI to storm the place the team is robbing, to make things less repettive, more intense and unpredictable.

Bosting. It would be nice to not give the players the ability to boost their stats, because that's a form of cheating. I bet that half of the players in the Top 100 are boosters.

Last but not least, I hate that the stats update only after a session end. It would make more sense for the stats update after each round, since some idiot hosts like to close the server after 4 out of 5 rounds, so the players lose the money and they earned in those 4 rounds.

For that matter, did I forget about something? Looking forward to reading about other issues and opinions.

[Zidrien]

I'd like to see a new rewards system. For example, If one player kills 6 teammates, 100k seems a little weak. How about if money gets added for each player that they kill. Example: 1 player killed, 100k. 2 players killed, 200k. 3 players killed, 300k. And so on. And I agree 100% with the self defence issue.

[Brackstone17]

Yeah, they need to find some way to let people defend themselves from potential traitors. I hope they make it so the person that acts first will become the traitor if he wins. Maybe if he shoots another player, that player can shoot back for a short time without fear of becoming a traitor. This causes a problem with friendly fire though.

[Dr Klowneus]

all the players in the top 100 are boosted profiles, all the players in the top 500 are boosted profiles, and probably in the top 1000. Boosters suck, id rather they have no stats at all than have a bunch of retards thinking they're omg im hardcore cause they boosted to a high rank, but yeah boosting's a problem

The other major problem, ask anyone who's played fa allot and they'll tell you the same thing, quitters, if people dont win, they quit, if people get killed they quit, the game shuts down and i the victorious doktor klown end up wasting my time and mad skills, left with a black screen and a sense of irritation and misanthropy, so yeah they need to fix that. dont know how, just do something

if your bad ass enough you can shoot everyone who comes at you, if you have a traitor sign or not, its part of the fun, so strap on ur vest, grab ur hockey mask and test ur skills. so i dont see it as a problem

[Bionicicide]

Never played it before, but that self-defense issue does sound like a problem. Don't know how that could be solved... if it should (again, didn't play it).

Originally Posted by Dr Klowneus

The other major problem, ask anyone who's played fa allot and they'll tell you the same thing, quitters, if people dont win, they quit, if people get killed they quit, the game shuts down and i the victorious doktor klown end up wasting my time and mad skills, left with a black screen and a sense of irritation and misanthropy, so yeah they need to fix that. dont know how, just do something

Host migration will solve it. Dedicated servers can too, but I don't expect that to happen.

[Nick@IO]

Originally Posted by Garrett Vega

There's a bunch of things that made the multiplayer worse for players. I'd like to point them out, along with a question about grenades.

So, first of all, it's the rumored lack of grenades in Dog Days.

This quote is from the giantbomb preview. I'd really like to know if that's true. And I'm more interested about the multiplayer, because while in the K&L1 single player grenades were useless (mostly because the AI didn't put up much of a fight), in Fragile Alliance they are very useful, mostly for flushing out human opponents out of cover and shooting them while they run for their soon to be over life. Without them combat will be more limited.

So would it be too much to ask for a confirmation from Nick?

Now, speaking of Fragile Alliance, there's a few issues that I'd really love to see get fixed.

One of them is getting marked as a traitor for self defense. In my experience this happens quite often: one player decides to be a traitor and starts shooting at me. Unfortunately for him, he uses the weak MP5 and I manage to get into cover before dying. So I get out of cover and manage to shoot him in the face first. And suddenly, I'm a traitor. How about that. Because of self defense, now I have a traitor sign and a 100k bounty on my head. And the rest of the team wants that 100k, along with the rest of my money. Is that supposed to be fair? Because if I want to be a traitor, I usually make the move when I can take the team out one by one, yet in these scenarios I have to battle them all at once.

Another problem is the police AI following the same path most of the time. I think there should be at least 2 or 3 ways for the AI to storm the place the team is robbing, to make things less repettive, more intense and unpredictable.

Bosting. It would be nice to not give the players the ability to boost their stats, because that's a form of cheating. I bet that half of the players in the Top 100 are boosters.

Last but not least, I hate that the stats update only after a session end. It would make more sense for the stats update after each round, since some idiot hosts like to close the server after 4 out of 5 rounds, so the players lose the money and they earned in those 4 rounds.

For that matter, did I forget about something? Looking forward to reading about other issues and opinions.

We're releasing a lot of information on multiplayer next month (basically laying the whole thing bare for you all), so stay tuned for your specific questions.

Regarding grenades - there are no grenades in the game. We have cannisters instead, and they are much more versatile and useful than grenades both in campaign and in multiplayer. I'll be uploading a blog post on that subject on the website soon as well.

[JackGordon]

Originally Posted by Nick@IO

We're releasing a lot of information on multiplayer next month (basically laying the whole thing bare for you all), so stay tuned for your specific questions.

You sir, made my day

[Bevacur]

They should not point out during multiplayer who is the traitor. Make things much more tense between players and will cause arguing as they will not know who did it and may end up killing the wrong player which will hopefully cause even more killing between the players. Showing distrust between each player.

The only way to win is to work together! Killing a guy with *TRAITOR* in big red capitols above is head is waaaay to easy. I say remove it. Like i said it will cause distrust and trigger happy players may kill the wrong guy and then gets blasted himself by his other team-mates because he killed the wrong guy.



Bevacur - Genius in the making.

[JackGordon]

Actually, I agree. Suddenly losing a member of the team and not knowing who exactly shot him... Everybody would start to panic and become paranoid. That would certainly make things very, very tense!

[Garrett Vega]

That's a stupid idea. All it would do is leave team killings unpunished. And I think you're missing the whole point ofbeing the traitor. It shouldn't be hard for the rest of the team, it should be hard for the traitor to survive. Which is exactly why it can be a lot of fun.

So much for your genius.

[JackGordon]

What would make it harder on the traitor is that the getaway car gets delayed until the traitor is either killed or the only one left (having killed all other mercs, unless those were killed by AI).

I still don't understand how a traitor was allowed to enter the getaway car together with merc in the first game, by the way...
EDIT: Come to think of it; with Bevacur's idea in mind, it would make more sense that a merc could escape with a traitor. Everyone would only discover who the traitor was at the end of the round, unless they saw him shoot their teammate(s).
EDIT 2: Actually, one could become a traitor using two methods. With a stealth kill; getaway car doesn't get delayed and no one knows who the traitor is until the end of the round. Or non-stealth; everyone knows who the traitor is and the getaway car gets delayed until he is dead or until he kills everyone else.

Damn, I could spend hours (over)thinking about Fragile Alliance.