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  #1  
Old 04-22-2012, 04:37 AM
Bingo205 Bingo205 is offline
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Default Some minor disappointments regarding the story.

I've just bought the game today and so far it's good. Nevertheless, I feel a being little let-down from the plot in regard to the cyberpunk theme. I've only reached Chapter 2(the Chinese city) so please don't spoil the story for me.

The in-game controversy of human augmentation is a little bit forced. Why are all "aug" people heavily discriminated against? Even hobos on the street look down on me. The game has yet to explained the reason behind this new "racism" to me so far. Does it tie with the previous Deus Ex?
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  #2  
Old 04-22-2012, 05:40 AM
m G h m u o s m G h m u o s is offline
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You been reading all the e-books and newspapers and stuff? A lot of details are hidden away. Well not hidden away, they're just not explained straight away to your face like you'd expect.

As for discrimination against augmented people, I'm pretty sure its just a preference like anything else. I talked to loads of NPCs who seemed friendly and weren't auged. Its basically just like someone showing off they have loads of technology / superior human capabilities or whatever. Like if showing off the newest smart phone or iPad or whatever, you might be cool with it or you might think they're a douche XD

Plus theres the whole obvious philosophical debate about messing with what it means to be human/power of God.
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Old 04-22-2012, 10:29 AM
kud13 kud13 is offline
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a large part of it is the haves vs hace-nots. people who can afford to get augs... well, they're considered "rich". Add to that the fact that they are then hooked to Neuropozyne for life... and augs become equivalent to a luxury drug--people don't like you b/c you can afford it, and they sneer and look down on you because you become dependent on it.
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  #4  
Old 04-22-2012, 05:30 PM
Bingo205 Bingo205 is offline
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Yes, that's how I role play in my game. I love the cyberpunk genre and do have some knowledge about it. In most cyberpunk fictional universe, Cybernetic implants cost a fortune to afford and maintain especially military grade implants. I believe augmentation should make people admire and envy, not disgust.

The fact that the game does not focus on the economic gap between the augmented elite and the exhausted proletarian but rather choose a silly "impressionist tranhumanist versus conservative fanatic purists" approach is a let down to me. It makes the core philosophy of the game cheaper. The humanity front purists seem like tree hugging hippies, fanatic bible thumpers, and paranoid racists all role into one, no one could sympathies with them. I was hoping a more "post modern wealthy elites versus miserable proletarians" approach.

Also, the debate against augmentation could have been an anti-gun debate in disguise. I was hugely disappointed when William Taggart of the Humanity front does not press Adam in this issues. Why would people need military grade augmentation or augmentation that provides superhuman strength? Guns are strictly regulated, why shouldn't augmentation be? Taggart could have become a much bigger character represent the opposite moral spectrum yet Eidos decides to give us a holier-than-thou hypocrite.

Last edited by Bingo205; 04-22-2012 at 05:41 PM.
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  #5  
Old 04-22-2012, 06:47 PM
OMGITSJASON OMGITSJASON is offline
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The collectibles along with NPC conversations helped bring the story out. At least for me they did.
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  #6  
Old 04-22-2012, 07:12 PM
m G h m u o s m G h m u o s is offline
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Quote:
Yes, that's how I role play in my game. I love the cyberpunk genre and do have some knowledge about it. In most cyberpunk fictional universe, Cybernetic implants cost a fortune to afford and maintain especially military grade implants. I believe augmentation should make people admire and envy, not disgust.
Surely you acknowledge there would obviously be people against it though. Some people are scared of change/technology, some people might be jealous/feel inferior, some may have conflicting religious beliefs and some people may just stick to simple personal principles.

But damn Bingo seems like you had some high expectations, all your ideas are really awesome. The whole rich vs poor was represented in the whole two tier city of Hengsha, but we ended up not being able to explore much of that unfortunately :s

Quote:
Also, the debate against augmentation could have been an anti-gun debate in disguise. I was hugely disappointed when William Taggart of the Humanity front does not press Adam in this issues. Why would people need military grade augmentation or augmentation that provides superhuman strength? Guns are strictly regulated, why shouldn't augmentation be? Taggart could have become a much bigger character represent the opposite moral spectrum yet Eidos decides to give us a holier-than-thou hypocrite.
Anti-gun debate would have had another level, but as for the augmentation regulation thing, you don't see any innocent civilians with any military grade augs, but as you play the game you will get a little glimpse into a sorta black market for augs. I read on the Sarif site that choosing to be auged, a step from augs being used as prosthetics for amputees or whatever, was legalised after a court case won by a guy put out of work because of auged people being more productive. I dunno, but its gonna be hard to flesh out an entire legal system in a game lol.
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  #7  
Old 04-22-2012, 08:53 PM
Bingo205 Bingo205 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m G h m u o s View Post
Surely you acknowledge there would obviously be people against it though. Some people are scared of change/technology, some people might be jealous/feel inferior, some may have conflicting religious beliefs and some people may just stick to simple personal principles.

But damn Bingo seems like you had some high expectations, all your ideas are really awesome. The whole rich vs poor was represented in the whole two tier city of Hengsha, but we ended up not being able to explore much of that unfortunately :s
Damn, we can't visit upper Hengsha? O_o. I have only begun a few quest in lower Hengsha. If it is true, i'm a little disappointed. Hengsha is a true symbol of rich educational elite living as near to heaven as possible while the less fortunate and criminal scums are forced to live in lower slum. I was hoping when we're done with lower city we will see upper Hengsha and BAM! The whole environment would change rapidly compares to lower Hengsha. Like having super clean and shiny surface floor and high tech environment everywhere, that sort of things. It would highlight that even though the new industry help bring China into superpower, common citizens are not benefited from it and the elite fat cats are the same in each countries.

Yeah, I acknowledge that there are surely people that would despise the augmented. But the game should clearly show that that the religious nuts and conservative purist are just radicals of the spectrum. The normal people should have a sort of love-hate relationship with the augmented. Just like nowadays, some women are insecure and follow the cosmetic surgery bandwagon while the rest of the society condemn unnecessary costly procedure and the vanity nature of it. There should be a wider spectrum of moral. Some would be tech/body modder junkie, some liberal, some conservative and some die-hard radical who are highly disgusted by this new augmentation trend. It should not be so two-sided.

Quote:
Originally Posted by m G h m u o s View Post
Anti-gun debate would have had another level, but as for the augmentation regulation thing, you don't see any innocent civilians with any military grade augs, but as you play the game you will get a little glimpse into a sorta black market for augs.
Oh, I was under the impression that military grade augs are easily obtained since almost all criminals have it. Yeah, but a stronger than normal human augmented could misuse his power as well. It would be great if the in-game anti-augs question this as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by m G h m u o s View Post
I read on the Sarif site that choosing to be auged, a step from augs being used as prosthetics for amputees or whatever, was legalised after a court case won by a guy put out of work because of auged people being more productive. I dunno, but its gonna be hard to flesh out an entire legal system in a game lol.
Wow, this seems interesting to read about. I remember hearing from a TV series from some years back is when cyborgs come to be, they would be so distinguished from normal humans that they can no longer consider homo sapien. That means the first time since Neanderthal, there would be two different sapien running around. It would have great if the game asks this moral story.
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Old 04-22-2012, 10:44 PM
m G h m u o s m G h m u o s is offline
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Oh crap I could have said some big spoilers XD I read that you have only gotten to Hengsha but seemed to forget instantly. Well hopefully your lowered expectations of Hengsha will only lead to some pleasant surprises.

Quote:
The normal people should have a sort of love-hate relationship with the augmented. Just like nowadays, some women are insecure and follow the cosmetic surgery bandwagon while the rest of the society condemn unnecessary costly procedure and the vanity nature of it. There should be a wider spectrum of moral. Some would be tech/body modder junkie, some liberal, some conservative and some die-hard radical who are highly disgusted by this new augmentation trend. It should not be so two-sided.
To be honest, I got that feeling from the game. I talked to pretty much every NPC. You can't expect them to have a full background for every character, but the range in comments pretty much gave me the impression that everyone has different opinions/preferences. I remember being able to listen in on a few debates NPCs have with each other, I dunno if its exactly what you're looking for though.

Quote:
Oh, I was under the impression that military grade augs are easily obtained since almost all criminals have it. Yeah, but a stronger than normal human augmented could misuse his power as well. It would be great if the in-game anti-augs question this as well.
Yeah its not really clear. You fight some enemies towards the end who have the typhoon aug, I wasn't entirely too clear if that was the tech they engineered from the typhoon stolen (or.. not stolen?) from Sarif but whatever. I feel like I'm just forgetting something on that note :P

Quote:
Wow, this seems interesting to read about. I remember hearing from a TV series from some years back is when cyborgs come to be, they would be so distinguished from normal humans that they can no longer consider homo sapien. That means the first time since Neanderthal, there would be two different sapien running around. It would have great if the game asks this moral story.
Yeah you can find the site through the sticky thread. I found it pretty interesting, loved how they mixed actual real life events/articles with their fiction.
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