prefer cpu with machines or without machines?

[jay--z]

hi as you guys know my team *SPQR and me are working on new mod for praertorians and i need to know if you guys like cpu with or without machines?
please vote and thanks:)

[theruler]

Do you mean Siege machines?

[jay--z]

yes, with machines i mean catapultes,battering ram and ballista for cpu
guys vote we need ur answers

[Hans Barca]

Do you mean Siege machines?

not the assault towers and ladders from campaign
just the skirmish battle machines

[theruler]

With.
I love to burn them down...


Why not?

[jay--z]

man no you got me wrong.. i mean do you like cpu to play with machines or not

[theruler]

them = enemies' machines.

[Hans Barca]

haha
and do you like to build machines urself?

[jay--z]

them = enemies' machines.

i'll try to make it simple,
when you play vs 5 cpu alone vs them.. you do great but all sudden they do machine and kill ur army with 10 sec with catapultas or ballistas while you didnt even have time to do machine,
after my fast explanation you would like to still see machines for cpu or not
and thx

[theruler]

Ok, I see the point.

I usually cope with this behaviour by building archers as soon as my captain is entered in the city.
You should have the time to build 4 archers and 2 spearmen to burn the incoming machines and engage the infantry that carry them (to stop manage the machines) as soon as they approach.

I do Love Catas.
But the superiority feeling that comes by killing half of their army with a well settled hit of my ballista is unmatched.
Ballistas, due to their strategic use are more exposed to cavalry or enemy fire, but assist them with troops and leave at its side auxiliary infantry and you are sure the ballistas will be protected and repaired promptly.

I love Elephants too!

[Devoti]

Oh, ok then, when u recruit a bigg army, would u like to be destroyed with 2 ballists, hehe, cuz believe me, i tried, lol so i think without machines with be much better, well, and i think machines are not fair, u know why?, because when some one wants to attack, and will put all of his troops on 1 point, and so, then machines (Catas Only) will destroy all of his army without losses, so i think that machines are good only for sieges, ok, cya^^

[Kajman]

I do Love Catas.

theruler, +1 Respect to YOU from Cohors Praetoria "Iron Scorpions"

CATAS and BALLISTAS are SUPER. They for real Warriors only. For Warriors who dont fear to fight and can think in battle as Commander. For Warriors who can attack and take enemy fortifications.

[jay--z]

good to see that you respect somoene lol ^^
IS i laugh ^^
in real life machines were only used for siege because sometimes a ballista or catapult can kill somes of your own army and we all know that there is no stupid general on earth who will put his army in danger of his own machines
:D

[theruler]

theruler, +1 Respect to YOU from Cohors Praetoria "Iron Scorpions"


Thank you, man! Now I am at +1 respect. Hope to gain more! :D

Anyway, in Roman period, Ballista was used in battles, to destroy light offensive or defensive structures. It was even reported the usage of portable ballistas during the Second Punic War, called SCORPIONS (now I should be to +2 respect, right Kajman?! :D ). The first use was, however, in siege, as you said, Jay, but has a little difference from the ones in our game... In real life ballistas, you can adjust elevating arc. And that's the reason why it was effective in sieges... You could have hit men on walls.

And that's the difference.
Let's speak only of the game... let's leave out real life implications.

In game:
Catas are "mainly" for sieges, and works well in skirmish. with a single unit of infantry you can build and command 3 catas in less than 5 minutes.

Ballistas are the definitive weapon in Skirmish, useless in sieges (you could use it to shoot at portals, but, belive me, it is never a good thing). But you have to know how to use them.
For me are still hard to manage. If you forget to give an order, you could say goodbye to 1/4 of your army.
Do not think ballistas are useless... they must stay ahead, and under open fire (may be with two legionary troops in testudo formation to absorb enemy arrows) they are easy to destroy, but if they manage to put a good hit (decreasing by 1/3, 1/4 the incoming enemy's army) and then destroied, they did the work they was built for.
How much did it cost? only few minutes... nothing else.


Pyro Studios put catas and ballistas in skirmish mode for a reason.
And it was a good reason, to me.
No need to remove them.
Anyway it is your mod, do as you wish.

[Kajman]

Thank you, man! Now I am at +1 respect. Hope to gain more!

Additional Respect
+1 for katas
+1 for ballistas
+1 for battle rams also
+1 For Good Replay "In game: Catas are "mainly" for sieges, and works well in skirmish. with a single unit of infantry you can build and command 3 catas in less than 5 minutes." I proove it's all really and very simply for this warriors who are able quickly to manage with mouse
+1 from Germanicus Valerius Victrix
+1 from me
+1 from Hasdrubal

[theruler]

there is no stupid general on earth who will put his army in danger of his own machines
:D

there are many, actually.
never heard of any "expendable pawns"?

And no stupids among those generals... only wise (but cruel) men that know well what loss-benefit ratio means.

[jay--z]

no a good general or commander would never even risk to kill any of his own army:)

[theruler]

points of view...
To me a good commander is the one that makes you win the battle (tactic).
The good general is the one that makes you win the War (strategy).

We all know there is no victory at no cost.

TheRuler.




:D

[jay--z]

it's ur point of view i respect it even tho still a leader wouldnt risk his machines to kill his own army.. maybe his war have cost but that cost aint to watch his soldiers die of his faults

[Hans Barca]

whenever i build machines, i get ballistas in front in 2 lines, with space in between. archers behind, then catas

ballistas kill advancing enemy, and when the enemy attack, they get drawn into attacking the machines, then archers cover, then ballistas, then my main troops attack. while my machines attack the troops behind the enemy first line (maybe archers, to avoid them attacking my own troops)

i just think of machines as 'useful for expendable diversion' :lol:

this way, i don't have to let my troops die of machines

[Hans Barca]

points of view...
To me a good commander is the one that makes you win the battle (tactic).
The good general is the one that makes you win the War (strategy).

i don't think a leader that wins a battle with severe costs of his own soldiers because he used his machines is a good leader.
to win a war, u need the troops
if the troops die in a battle cos of some machines that keep killing ur troops, u can't win a war

[theruler]

You got me wrong, or probably I didn't express myself corretctly enough.

If my front line ballista has been engaged by a praetorians troop (or another key enemy troop), I HAVE to command my catas to fire at them... knowing that this will lead to losses for my side... but if we put the mine and enemy's on a Libra... (7 aux infantry Vs 16 praetorians...)

I never talked about deliberately kill my troops due to poor commands management.
I usually pay great attention at what my machines are aiming to.
If it happens to have losses due to my own fire, it was cause I wanted to. What else? Nespresso? :lol: err... I mean... Human error, maybe? :rolleyes:


cheers.

[Hans Barca]

aha, but its not just the 7 aux infantry
read the rest of the post:
archers behind the ballistas, and other main troops behind them

[Hans Barca]

the other troops would charge - and obviously, i stop the catas from attacking the praetorians, etc:)

[Hans Barca]

u should have +1 point for humour
the forums are getting too dull and "unused" a bit :lol:

[theruler]

You're welcome!
It seem I've found the right people! ;)

[Maximus|SoI|SPQR]

i dont care, i play in 2 ways, doesnt make a defference lol!

[[c++]RakonDark]

it's ur point of view i respect it even tho still a leader wouldnt risk his machines to kill his own army.. maybe his war have cost but that cost aint to watch his soldiers die of his faults

but thats happend in all wars, in golf war , in the next war and so on,

friendly fire means, command not listen, or bad commanding..

everytime, dont thing the game is the problem, you are the problem, make with nothing to buidl then its so easy a tetris player can play...

but why reduce to noob game... learn to defend and attack .
To sent a bundle of troops by 1 click against balista is not a balista problem

its defenitly your problem you have 10 keys to make groups

if you have all troops on agressive then dont wonder what they do. better learn to command more then 1 troop , otherwise we are a poor community, realy, any ego shooter need more brain, if we kill all tactics cause the noobs dont wanna learn a game.

Praetorians Light : no burn, no hawk, all map view on ..... what you want more, no healer ? , no magic , no fast builder ??

come letz restrict to one arme, Romans with no special while this you can play and drink coffee and tea .


thats my opinion ... or call it : MoD 5.0 light

btw : In chess there are same bugs, and nobody change the rules, they learn the strategic to defend or to know before how to do a step , to get not in that trap :-)))

[jay--z]

so you allowing machines would be for you like gay camper with 10 towers and 10 machines:) any army u send is dead in 0.2 secs:D

i accept guy to make machines.. but for me for moment max is 2 catas and 2 towers and 1 bllistas

anyway just the me meant that^^ xd

[Michel]

with machines they sucks using them :D lol

[Michel]

guyz i wan't ask u a question is that right that machines not fair ?
is that right that towers for chickens ?
is that right that machines not allowded in multiplayer mode ?

[Mr.Fire]

yes they arent fair, cuz they arent balanced.... its too easy to kill 300 man army with just 1 infantry troup = 4 catas...

in noob/medium games they could be fair, yes, cuz they dont know to use them perfect way...

but in pro games with some players who know all about that old game( yes i would say im one of them xDDD ) its just not balanced, cuz there nearly all situations are played perfect, and it would be too easy to wait on a hill with a 100 man army and 4-8 catas, and you easy kill a 300-400 man-army.... that cant be!

and nobody of experts complain about that rule that we doesnt build machines and towers....

in beginner games, you can build catas and towers for sure....

[Error96]

With machines for sure

[carthaginian soldier]

i hate balistas when u have a big army and a balista comes and cuts aline throught your soldiers it kills about 100 men i hate them loads but peltasts hunters numidian cavelry and baleric slingers do lots od damage to them