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darien_specter
06-28-2002, 12:19 PM
Changed my mind. Hey - I'm proud of these, and Umah did say "good old debates"... so here we are...

originally posted May 3rd, 2002
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It's been awhile since I've posted anything, so I've had some time to ponder things. Bear in mind that I haven't played Blood Omen 2, nor do I know much about it. (Except for the completely illogical presence of the extraordinarily dead Vorador...) But I have been thinking about where Raziel fits into the story told in the paintings seen throughout Nosgoth.

I begin with the painting on the door to the underground chamber of the Pillars. We see a member of the winged race depicted. As someone else has recently pointed out, the paiting looks very much to be a portrait of Raziel himself: we see his hair, his all-white eyes, and the sigil of the Reaver inscribed on the door. There is also the fact that this door may be opened only through the use of the Reaver, and that access to the canyon is only possible through the spectral realm. What the capabilities of all the winged race in this regard, we do not know; but this almost leads me to believe that it is Raziel himself who has built this place, as a sanctuary of some sort. (This last is but wild speculation, of course.) In any case, add to this depiction the statue in the Fire Forge, which is even more clearly a depiction of Raziel, bearing the Reaver. (A Reaver which lights on fire...)

Next to the murals in the underground chamber of the Pillars, the four themes repeated throughout the elemental forges of Nosgoth. In the first we see the war between the winged race and the demonic. Already established is the presence of the Reaver as their chief weapon, wielded by one of race (possibly even a young Janos, as he is the Reaver Guardian.) Here also the Reaver is depicted with a red aura, implying its existence as the Blood Reaver.

In the second, we see the Pillars raised by the winged race, dealing the demonic a mortal blow.

In the third things heat up. The presumably victorious winged race is afflicted with the blood thirst as a curse, from an unknown source. They appear to be in agony over this change. Note also that they are feeding on the blood of livestock - a deer or a cow or some such. It is clear that they did not, at least in the beginning, need human blood, and one wonders when (and in the case of the winged race I might even ask if) they turned to it.

It is the final panel that intrigues me the most. The preceding three are clearly historical. This one is, I think, more prophetic. We see two of the winged race, blood dripping from their mouths, looking up at a third. This one has no blood dripping from his mouth; he is then perhaps free of the blood curse. His wings have a golden aura about them, significant perhaps of a greater power, or perhaps an otherworldliness about this figure. The figure also bears the Reaver, but transformed: the Reaver now posesses a golden aura. (Further, he alone of the figures depicted is wearing any sort of leg bracers.)


It is my opinion that this mural presents a prophecy of one who would come to the winged race as their savior - the mural depicts Raziel. Consider the Reaver, clearly the Soul Reaver - the golden aura consitent with the souls of the humans. The aura about the figure - perhaps an attempt to represent Raziel's ability to shift into the spectral world? And note also that the figure is free of the blood curse - again, as is Raziel, now a devourer of souls. (He is also wearing the leg bracers wery similar to those Raziel still wears.)


My theory is this. As I have stated elsewhere, I believe that Raziel will find the heart, and that it will have an effect upon him as well, restoring to him his body and his wings, advancing his evolution into one of the winged race. He will reclaim the Reaver, which has, through Kain's actions, perhaps still acquired enough of Raziel's essence to be transformed while leaving him still alive, as he was weak to the point of death at the end of SR2. (Besides, let's all think about it - ten to one they use that as the excuse to yank poor Raziel's health spiral back down to weenie levels in the beginning of SR3...) Consider, also, that this is accomplished in part through Raziel's choice. In the original timeline, he kills Kain at William's tomb; thus, no one is there to yank the sword from Raziel's body, and he is entirely consumed. In sparing Kain, he saved his own life by permitting Kain to be present at that critical juncture.

Thus, restored and elevated, and bearing his weapon - its powers amplified by the existence of the wraith blade - he will be able to access all of the fonts, doors, etc. with the combined Soul Reaver. The end of his journey lies, I suspect, farther back into Nosgoth's past; thus, we will have Raziel - full-fledged as one of the winged race, yet more - bearing the Soul Reaver to the ancients and thwarting the designs of the Elder and the Hylden (whoever they may be.)

The theory as to what will happen is sort of a shot in the dark as to what all the other stuff might mean; but I feel strongly that the interpretation of the murals is near the mark, as well as the new nature of the Soul Reaver after the monumental shift at the end of SR2. I look forward to comments...

EDIT: Made an aesthetic similarity parenthetical...

Farfaniccio
06-28-2002, 08:19 PM
Consider, also, that this is accomplished in part through Raziel's choice. In the original timeline, he kills Kain at William's tomb; thus, no one is there to yank the sword from Raziel's body, and he is entirely consumed. In sparing Kain, he saved his own life by permitting Kain to be present at that critical juncture.



I can't remember where in the story that kain got the reaver but could it have been that he took it from the dead Raziel, or at least that is where he obtained it post-SR2? Because originaly Kain killed the Sarafan, right, so when Raziel does it, again with the reaver, he takes the place of Kain, but Kain still must get the reaver or Raziel never could have had it as it wouldnt have been broken in SR1.


just a thought

Jedilvr
06-28-2002, 09:07 PM
If I'm understanding you correctly Farfaniccio, this might answer your questions. 1. Kain originally got the Soul Reaver in the Avernus Cathedral in BO1. 2. Kain never killed the Sarafan, they were long dead by Kain's time. Hope this helped, otherwise sorry.

darien_specter
06-28-2002, 10:52 PM
Yes, Blood Omen happens 500 years after the end of SR2. It might help to check out the "Reaver Chronology," that untwists all the time travel a bit. I'm also (surprise!) concocting a new theory that should stir up some fun debating... Look for it in a day or two, it sort of connects to the time issues.

Farfaniccio
06-29-2002, 07:51 AM
Ok, I wasnt sure, since I havent played either Blood Omen game, but have beaten both Soul Reaver games. I also didn't pay much attention to the history given, just the story given in the cut scenes of the game. This does make me wonder though...
If Kain pulls the Reaver from Raziel after they travel through time, presumably Kain will return to his time and then he has the Reaver again? possibly this was an elaborate plot by Kain all along to get rid of Raziel, if only for a little while, and regain the reaver.

DMK_Uriel
06-29-2002, 01:36 PM
perhaps the reaver that Kain encounters is the reaver that belonged to william, as mobius could put it in avernus....

DMK_Uriel
06-29-2002, 01:38 PM
forget what i said....
i have forgot that its necessary to have a reaver before....

Jedilvr
07-01-2002, 08:14 AM
I'm wondering what would happen if after pulling the Reaver out of Raz. Kain decided no to put it in the Cathedral. That would prevent him from having it in the battle with William, which would have prevented that first paradox. And with all this time traveling, why didn't Kain stop his fledgling self from killing William in the first place?

darien_specter
07-01-2002, 10:30 AM
For one thing, William has to get it before it can be put in the cathedral... but it's still a good question - why doesn't Kain just keep it? If for no other reason than that he wants to pass it to Raziel when he revives...

Kain the fledgling seems to have been really stubborn, so he may not have believed himself that killing William was a really bad idea. Even that was similar damned if you do, damned if you don't choice Moebius orchestrated: If Kain doesn't kill William, then the Nemesis overruns all of Nosgoth. And besides, Doc Brown would show up and flip out, and Marty would never be born... :D

royalmarine1980
07-02-2002, 09:59 PM
LOL Guess who got the Special Ed. DVD's of Back to the Future :D

darien_specter
07-02-2002, 10:06 PM
WOW, I didn't even know there were special editions... have to put those on my list. For when I have a DVD player... and a TV bigger than 13 inches...